General Who Needs To Go?

Vancent

🫣
Contributor
Whilst I like Tupou, you don't see players of his (current) calibre in Champion teams. I'd only rehire him if he drastically improves or we can't find anyone better.

As for Carlos, I would absolutely hate to see him in a different team. If we don't resign him, I will cry a little.

I'll admit I'm a Vatuvei "hater" who believes he is no longer at the NRL standard. I am fully aware of what he has done for the club but, like you say, that's history.
To paraphrase Two-Face from the Dark Knight movie (the one with Joker), "You either retire a great player or play long enough to see yourself become mud". Vatuvei, at least in my eyes, has entered the mud phase.

Not directed at every comment more so the Carlos and Vatuvei comments. As I said, one's just getting started and frankly did himself proud, the other has had an average year out of several very good ones. Add to that a refreshed frame from the boxing play and I for one am curious to see how he goes, he may want his Kiwi spot back!

As the fans, if we don't show some semblance of loyalty to the newbies and the seasoned campaigners we become petulant little brats that spend too much time in forums drowning in last years misery rather than getting pumped about this year!!

As for Tupou and Ropo I have to agree, Sam not so, he is a benchmark prop in any team and another who's had bad injuries but not as much as others.
 
This should be Ropo's last season. The guy hasn't performed at all for about four years now and is living on reputation. Even when he is fit his level of play is just not acceptable. He is standing in the way of younger guys and even though he appears to be an incredibly humble and good person, it is in the team's best interest that he is cut loose if his performances are much the same this season. I hope he isn't given the starting centre role again strait off the bat like last year without having proved himself.

Tupou too, I mean I get it that we dont have many other options at this current time and that is a very sad indication of our lack of depth at wing. It is something that we really need to address, because the sooner we see the back of Tupou then the better for the Warriors.

Those are the two that really stand out for me.
 

mt.wellington

Warriors Orange Peeler
Part 1/2

The Warriors underutilization of the reserve grade has been disappointing to say the least but Im comforted by ME's approach to it and hope he and John Ackland can see eye to eye on this issue. TBH I think players like Taylor, Henry, Hurrell, Shaun Johnson, Lousi's brothers and Ikahihifo should of played in the Vulcans years ago or at least last year for the younger blokes. I would even have the new U20 captain David Bhana in the Vulcans now for the next 2 years. Before the U20's competition began in 2008 this is exactly what use to happen. Isaac John, Constantine Mika, Russell Packer, Leeson Ah Mau and Sonny Fai all played in the Vulcans team of 2007. Its all well and good being the most dominate U20's team in the NYC but development wise we are doing the more promising kids a huge disservice.

I have posted on this before but if you look at the Broncos approach to development than you'll appreciate that while their U20's teams suck most seasons, they still produce a higher calibre of young players due to the way they utilise their 2-3 feeder clubs in the QLC. If you look at their U20's squad it is mainly made up of 17-18 year olds. Most of the promising youngsters are 'promoted' to the feeder clubs. Playing against and being mentored by men is exactly what some of our young guns need.

The seperate NSWC and QLC serves nobody any purpose but the state competition holders themselves. I would argue that it actually impedes a players progress by not having them pit themselves against the best there is. Similar to the NSWRL move of 1995, I think its high time both organisations did the right thing and cede control of both comps to the NRL. Cant see it happening though so I would like to see the NRL have a genuine attempt at resurrecting the reserve grade. I agree with earlier posts that this not only needs to happen but that it also needs to be elevated above the U20 competition. Surely the NRL with an estimated $1.3 billion dollars in the bank can afford this. They have made some noises about investing in these types of initiatives so I have high hopes.

As for the which players I think need to go. If we take the question at face value and want to get rid of a player that isnt performing or is expendable as the squad stands now then the simple answer is no one! I'll explain.

Alehana Mara - Although languishing in the Vulcans isnt probably what he had in mind he is only one of 2 specialist hookers in the squad. He is our cover for Nathan Friend, a point clearly demonstrated when he replaced Friend in the 10th round of last year after Friends broken jaw heroics of the previous game. Because of this and the depth he adds to the Warriors, he stays put.

Steve Rapira - I have to admit to being a little disappointed with Steve as I certainly expected more. The fact is though, he is also part of the depth we have at the Warriors for second row. He wont get a call up unless Mannering, Lowrie or Mateo get injured but its good to know that if they do there is someone with almost 40 NRL games to his name that can step into the breach if needed. I also put him ahead of the Lousi brothers for second row cover (for the moment) and believe due to his constant injuries we havent seen the best he has to offer. Needs to stop this running out of the line to 'smash him bro' the opposition BS cause he misses more often then he connects and throws the whole line out.

Sione Lousi - It was sad to see him elevated too soon last year. Cover for a couple of games yes, but to be a in the starting lineup week to week just showed the lack of depth the Warriors had. He simply wasnt ready. I hold high hopes for him though. He is a great tackler and although he wasnt his best last year the reality is 95% of team wasnt. He does needs to work on his workrate in terms of his hitups. May just be a fitness issue. Cant say from experiance but I bet running into a wall of defenders then trying to pump your legs with 3 extra people on you all day is really tough work! This will be worked on in the Vulcans no doubt and is definately being addressed with the first grade squad.

Sam Lousi - Had to laugh when I saw suggestions that Sam should be let go. This kid is a freak and IMO shows more promise than his older brother. He still looks awkward and some what clumsy at the moment but he needs time to break in that 6ft 6 in and 110kg+ body of his. Only 21 this July so he has a good year or 2 before this will happen. It is said that most prop/2nd rowers dont really hit form till they are 23-24 so theres time. I really am excited about this kid and would be gutted if the Warriors released him. Performance based withstanding.

Sebastine Ikahihifo - This kid is another freak! Though not as tall as Sam he still looks very promising. Just turned 21 its still early days for Seb. I question whether lock is his best suited position but thats up to ME. Bit harsh to critise the kid after only 4 first grade games. The fact he was even considered is amazing. What I like most about Ikahihifo is he has abit of mongrel in him. That combined with his size and a year or 2 in the Vulcans will IMO produce a machine the other NRL players will come to fear.

TBC...
 

mt.wellington

Warriors Orange Peeler
Part 2/2

Carlos Tuimavavae - Anyone who has chosen this kid needs a kick up the ass! How one can come to this conclusion after him being called up before his time and played in 4-5 different positions in a halfass injure riddled team and only playing 5 NRL games is laughable. This kid is an athlete and has a good footy brain. I personally thought he went well considering all the obstacles he had to overcome. I expect to see him run out in some capacity this year. Whether he has the goods to carve out a career in the NRL remains to be seen but he isnt a bad player to place a bet on. Probably be used as a utility player off the bench but he will be a future Warrior. Has at least 2-3 years before we can mention his name in this thread again.

Elijah Taylor - He has his detractors on this forum but I for one want to go on the record as saying that I really rate this guy. I honestly believe he will eventually replace Luck as the go to tacklebot but just needs to perfect his technique and up the stamina levels. He has all the right tools physically and, more importantly, mentally. Turning 23 soon he still hasnt even come close to realising his potential. Lets not forget that Micheal Luck was playing mainly off the bench and was released to us as a no name 23 year old. It wasnt till a couple years later that he truly peaked making the most tackles in the NRL, breaking the tackle record on a game and being named 18th man on the greatest team to ever play Origin ever, Queensland;). Comparing Elijah to either Lowrie or Mannering is unfair. They both have far more experiance and have taken years to develop. For all the hype about Lowrie, the fact is he is a journeymen. Taylor IMO will be part of the run on squad. He will most likely play off the bench. I predict him to improve greatly this season and go on to become one of the true Warriors clubmen. You can quote me on that.

Sam Rapira - I swear some of you guys must be smoking too much weed or something! Sam would need to be constantly injured for 2 straight years before the Warriors release this guy. His injuries are a great concern but the fact is, fully fit, he is the best prop we have. When this run of injuries happens to Ben Matulino will you be calling for his head as well? I think not. As hit on in an earlier post prop is the hardest position physically. Every coach knows this and expects their props to have a bad run sooner or later. There are of course exceptions but there will always be freaks. Everybody just needs to chill about Sam. He had a bad run last year but played 20 games during the 2011 season. You know, the season we made the GF and he was instrumental in setting the platform for the other props to follow? Yeah, that season. That guy.

Jerome Ropati - As you may know, Im a huge Ropati fanboy. TBH alot of it is to do with his past performances when he was in form and I can admit to that. In saying that, I believe if he so much as breaks a fingernail this season then he will be gone. I dont believe though that he needs to go before then. IMO when he is fully fit he will be a starting centre. I know alot of people will disagree but thats my view anyway. I dont think he is the complete fuckup some are suggesting.

Bill Tupou - Of all players, I would like to see him at the very least replaced. He neednt be shown the door. He will still provide good depth cover. If he's happy waiting in the wings (sorry!) in the Vulcans then so be it. I think the salary he's on wont justify it though. In saying all that, I dont see it happening. Not this season without a mid-season transfer. He is the best option we have at the moment and at 22 years old he needs to start showing us what he can do. The Warriors have certainly invested alot of time into him so they must see some potential in him. Heres hoping for a breakout season for Tupou.

Ben Henry - Im a little puzzled by Benry. Im not sure where to play him. I would like to see him developed as a 2nd row/lock. The kid can tackle and has a great defensive mind. The way he shut down one of the worlds best players in Greg Inglis last year was amazing to watch. Nothing wrong with having him as depth.

Most the players mentioned above are still developing. Most were made to look mediocre last season but then most youngsters will when lined up against the best players the league world has to offer. Not all will make it as regular first graders of course but unless they're given time, we will never know. I think most the youngsters just need more development. They also need the right sort. If they're all happy to play bridesmaid in the Vulcans then so be it. As long as they are genuine depth options then they are earning their keep and salaries. Half will be on minimal NRL salary or just above anyway. Those with short memories forget the complete lack of depth we had last season. Its one of the reasons why we had to rely on our inexperienced juniors.The main issue is most will probably seek releases with the offer of more game time too hard to resist. And fair enough too. To ask for a release to join another team however is different to being released because your no longer wanted/needed as the original question begs

warriorworkhorse, to compare any of our juniors to freaks like Jason Taumalolo and Marika Koroibete is just plain stupid. These guys are freaks and very rarely do you see young players come through like that. You do your arguement no favours by handpicking 2 of the best young players and using that as an example of how our players are 'failing to impress'. Your comparison is unfair. Konrad Hurrell, Ben Matulino, Russell Packer, Shaun Johnson are all products of our juniors system. I rate all as impressive. Would you also seriously trade Tuimavave, Bill Tupou, Sebastine Ikahahifo, and both Lousi brothers for drug cheating, knocked out by a kid, 30 year old Reni Maitua! Where would you play Lama Tasi? Prop or 2nd row? In place of who? I think the grass is plenty green in our own patch...
 
According to the squad contract status page in this forum the players that are coming off contract this year are

Nathan Friend
Pita Godinet
Kevin Locke
Sione Lousi
Sam Lousi
Alehana Mara
Feleti Mateo
Jerome Ropati
Elijah Taylor
Manu Vatuvei
Steve Rapira

Players that are off contract right now are:

Sebastine Ikahihifo
Dylan Collier
Ivan Penehe
 

Danpatmac

Guest
On the nrl gossip page on facebook has said Elijah Taylor has signed with the panthers for 2014, don't know how much merit is in this.

I don't really see him as much of a loss tbh.

And as for those suggesting that Benry will be good for depth... I certainly get the feeling that the club doesn't see him as depth, they see him as much better than that, which disappoints me as I haven't seen anything to suggest he has the offensive game required.
 
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I don't really see him as much of a loss tbh.

And as for those suggesting that Benry will be good for depth... I certainly get the feeling that the club doesn't see him as depth, they see him as much better than that, which disappoints me as I haven't seen anything to suggest he has the offensive game required.

How long is Benry signed up for? Hope we didn't dish out a three year deal. Happy to have him as depth cover.

As for Taylor, if true. I want him released immediately. I'd say keep him around this season for depth but we all saw how Maloney turned out.

Very replaceable IMO. We've got better prospects and we mustn't waste any time giving them more experience.
 
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mt.wellington

Warriors Orange Peeler
Well if it's true about Taylor I'm disappointed (ok fkn gutted!) but not totally surprised..... I'm sick of this signing with another club 14 months out bs!
I hope this rumour started with Josh Massoud from The Daily Telegraph because his last few articles have all turned out to be BULLSHIT! If this 'rumour' is to prove correct then I would be truly gutted! As mentioned, I really do rate this kid. He may have clones on the rise as well but Im yet to see someone from the recent lot of NYC graduates with his drive and dedication. Its those 2 qualities that will ensure he succeeds. Im not surprised that, with all the players coming off contract this year and the next, Ivan Cleary has singled him out. IMO this will be huge a loss and we will regret this in a couple years time. Cant wait to tell you all I told you so...
 
I hope this rumour started with Josh Massoud from The Daily Telegraph because his last few articles have all turned out to be BULLSHIT! If this 'rumour' is to prove correct then I would be truly gutted! As mentioned, I really do rate this kid. He may have clones on the rise as well but Im yet to see someone from the recent lot of NYC graduates with his drive and dedication. Its those 2 qualities that will ensure he succeeds. Im not surprised that, with all the players coming off contract this year and the next, Ivan Cleary has singled him out. IMO this will be huge a loss and we will regret this in a couple years time. Cant wait to tell you all I told you so...

He's already a decent player. Could even get better yet. But the debate is whether his qualities are best suited to our particular needs. Don't not rate him but he's not an attacking force, not even a impact player and IMO that's what we need.
 

Inruin

Contributor
Glad too see the back of Taylor...he can take his 20m and 30 tackle assists per/game to Penrith
as long as he doesn't go thiis year (assuming rumour is true). I don't believe in releasing a player, even if he is just here for depth, even if he is the 15th second rower in line, to another club to make them stronger. he is contracted for this year, he stays here this year. whenever we release anyone you know that by some bad luck the other 14 players ahead of him in that position get injured and fall over and we end up short in that position.
 
Part 1/2

The Warriors underutilization of the reserve grade has been disappointing to say the least but Im comforted by ME's approach to it and hope he and John Ackland can see eye to eye on this issue. TBH I think players like Taylor, Henry, Hurrell, Shaun Johnson, Lousi's brothers and Ikahihifo should of played in the Vulcans years ago or at least last year for the younger blokes. I would even have the new U20 captain David Bhana in the Vulcans now for the next 2 years. Before the U20's competition began in 2008 this is exactly what use to happen. Isaac John, Constantine Mika, Russell Packer, Leeson Ah Mau and Sonny Fai all played in the Vulcans team of 2007. Its all well and good being the most dominate U20's team in the NYC but development wise we are doing the more promising kids a huge disservice.

I have posted on this before but if you look at the Broncos approach to development than you'll appreciate that while their U20's teams suck most seasons, they still produce a higher calibre of young players due to the way they utilise their 2-3 feeder clubs in the QLC. If you look at their U20's squad it is mainly made up of 17-18 year olds. Most of the promising youngsters are 'promoted' to the feeder clubs. Playing against and being mentored by men is exactly what some of our young guns need.

The seperate NSWC and QLC serves nobody any purpose but the state competition holders themselves. I would argue that it actually impedes a players progress by not having them pit themselves against the best there is. Similar to the NSWRL move of 1995, I think its high time both organisations did the right thing and cede control of both comps to the NRL. Cant see it happening though so I would like to see the NRL have a genuine attempt at resurrecting the reserve grade. I agree with earlier posts that this not only needs to happen but that it also needs to be elevated above the U20 competition. Surely the NRL with an estimated $1.3 billion dollars in the bank can afford this. They have made some noises about investing in these types of initiatives so I have high hopes.
solid posts brother

there is one thing id love to happen in regards to lower grades - Lets use Bhana as an example. the first couple of games he kills it for the NYC, id like he gets a tap on the shoulder and get told he is getting elevated to the vulcans. Now after a couple of games drop him back to the NYC and give him things to work on. whether thats the speed of his play the ball, one on one defense or what ever it may be. he has 5 or 6 games back in the NYC then he gets another run in the vulcans to see how he is improved and how he can handle it.

also the vulcans should be used in the same way for first graders. especially fringe first graders and young players coming through grade. Sioni lousi, Konni even shaun johnson are examples of how this could be beneficial. Shaun Johnson could drop down and work on running the team better or his defense. when he improves he gets elevated back up.
 
I was talking to elijah taylors good friend and he said he was going to penrith on a hefty contract nearing 500,000. honestly dont think hes worth that but cleary must think he is.
 

KPWarrior

Contributor
for that kinda $$ they would have kept Jennings! I think the Pamfers are clearing the decks to make a serious play for some big off contract names in 2014 and probably pick up some bargains along the way.
 

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