General Season 2010

MightyWarriors_old

Guest
With our victory tonight, 2010 is now our most successful regular season since we installed Cleary as head coach and the best since 2003. Though we finished 4th overall in 2007, we were able to do so with 29 points due to Melbourne's outright domination that year. With the injury toll we were served, and given the foundation we were working off with the abomination that was 2009, what we've achieved in 2010 is really remarkable. Whether we can make a real dent in the finals series is yet to be seen, but the quality of this year in spite of enormous adversity is something to be proud of and Cleary, Iro as well as lesser lights such as David Fairleigh, Ruben Wiki and Craig Walker deserve enormous acknowledgement. Finishing in the top 4 would really cap off what has been an impressive season from a core group of players who'll go on and be our future.
 

MightyWarriors_old

Guest
Fairleigh's been assisting Ivan throughout the season and those around the club have been really impressed with his input. Central Coast doesn't have a team to coach just yet.
 

ToiletDuck_old

Guest
I still rank 2008 as our most successful year in the Cleary era.

That Storm game and then visions of a skinny, pale Kirk streak away with that intercept against the Roosters are still vivid in my mind.

'07 was just a **** tease year - finish 4th then 2 finals losses.

Overall, the Cleary-phobes (you know who you are) - need to take a look at the big picture. Bringing through the youngsters as appropriate. Recruiting on the improve (at least in theory) - we have actual first graders coming to the club. And not afraid to make a big call or two, while it could have been handled with a little more care, the Mannering captaincy decision I believe has turned out to be the correct one - whether Price had played or not.
 

PB_old

Guest
Yeah. Big ups to the club. Across the board really. From Cleary, his cohorts, and the top team facing many trying circumstances, to Ackland and the NYC crew, and the club's back-of-house. However, a special thanks has to go to Doc Mayhew Jude Spiers. I'm sure they've clocked a bit of overtime this year.

A good effort all around, and hopefully more to come.

Iafeta mentioned words to the effect, earlier in the year, that maybe Ivan needed to have his own terrible year to develop and learn as a coach. Given everything, I think he's done that.

This year could be the making of the club. For the first time in their careers, Mateo and Inu will be at a club that is used to players doing insane things at inappropriate times.

We could be the making of them too.
 

Jesbass_old

Guest
I think the New Zealand public has demonstrated many times its fickleness when it comes to chasing success. (And English football is notorious for this.) If the new guy doesn't win a Premiership immediately or score a hattrick on debut, he should be scrapped.

The same can be said of the coaching outfit. If we'd sacked Cleary at the end of 2009, (or after 5 rounds in 2010 as some were suggesting might happen), we'd have lost all of the learning process that had happened from the dizzying heights of 2008 to the ignominious depths of 2009.

Just as Manu had to have his baptism of fire in that match against Parramatta to discover true greatness, Cleary perhaps needed an awful year to really learn how to coach. I think it's clear that he's grown as a result, and by endorsing him even in his darkest hours, the club has taken a longer term approach, which I applaud.

I'd much rather miss out on a Premiership this year and potentially create a dynasty than have a quick fix that turns sour. Hopefully, though, now that we're in the finals and in good form, we can have our cake and eat it too!
 

KeepingTheFaith_old

Guest
Our team is built on players who have had a less than conventional road to our club

Maloney, Seymour, Brown, Ta'ai, Luck, Royal, Heremaia. To a lesser extent Mannering/Matulino who played junior rugby up until their late teens.

The hard times are what make you a better player/person, and this has made Cleary a better coach. A premiership coach, I still have my doubts, but he's definately a better coach because of it.
 

gREVUS_old

Guest
I would like to acknowledge for a while there i too was one calling for changes in the coaching department. I was wrong Ivan was right. Long may it last
 

Lego_Man_old

Guest
I think the New Zealand public has demonstrated many times its fickleness when it comes to chasing success. (And English football is notorious for this.) If the new guy doesn't win a Premiership immediately or score a hattrick on debut, he should be scrapped.

The same can be said of the coaching outfit. If we'd sacked Cleary at the end of 2009, (or after 5 rounds in 2010 as some were suggesting might happen), we'd have lost all of the learning process that had happened from the dizzying heights of 2008 to the ignominious depths of 2009.

Just as Manu had to have his baptism of fire in that match against Parramatta to discover true greatness, Cleary perhaps needed an awful year to really learn how to coach. I think it's clear that he's grown as a result, and by endorsing him even in his darkest hours, the club has taken a longer term approach, which I applaud.

I'd much rather miss out on a Premiership this year and potentially create a dynasty than have a quick fix that turns sour. Hopefully, though, now that we're in the finals and in good form, we can have our cake and eat it too!

We failed to sign Adam Blair, for me that makes this season an utter failure. I'd rather have the spoon.
 

Iafeta_old

Guest
My take on last year had a lot to do with Sonny's loss. When you're trained to live in a very tight culture, where you turn up for each other... and then that brother is gone. And not just gone, but gone in an absolute tragedy. There was no real closure either, Sonny's body never returned and while it's only symbolic to some degree psychologically it doesn't help the closure process which is an important necessity of the grief cycle. Last year the first five games (trials and NRL games) we won. It seemed to follow what was expected, you are pumped for the guy, you want to do it for the guy, but then that goes when your mind slips to knowing he isn't coming back in any capacity. People wanted to summarise the coaching staff off the back of that. They shouldn't be refused access for criticism, but when his coaching form before that was impressive it seemed illogical given the tough times to really assess if he no longer could coach the team in a normal climate. I also remembered what happened at Penrith after Ben Alexander's tragic passing, the club went into a bit of a free for all and guys who were stoically aligned to the Panthers had to get as far away from it as possible. Mark Geyer ended up going to Western Australia, Greg Alexander over here to the Warriors. Those two moves were clearly done to get away from the emotional pressures that haunted that club. There's no textbook as to how to deal with this, we certainly couldn't look back at how Penrith did it because on the field it wasn't that good.

So you go back to before 2009. 2003-2004 Ivan did an outstanding job with the Roosters in their lower grades. 2005 there was a lot of good words about his impact, and Kevin Campion's impact in trying to change the culture of the club. 2006 he inherits the salary cap, and he has a reasonable season all things considered. 2007 he takes us to the finals, I think this is the year we get a home final. 2008 he takes us to the finals, one short of the grand final, beats the Melbourne Scum in Melbourne, first time ever 8 beats 1. A lot of people criticise the role John Hart played in 2009, but the one thing he kept saying was that Ivan Cleary was a superb coach. John Hart should know coaches and their mental make up, even if it is a different code. Hart was a tremendous coach in his own right and through the ABs he would have been involved with a group of top coaches. Not only did they praise him, but they re-signed him long term, despite the 2009 outcomes. That to me says something.

That's just my view.

Onto this season, given the injury toll what the club has achieved is amazing, in both grades. The club has said publically it sees itself as a development club. The proof is that this club is topping the club championship. The proof is that a number of U20s are moving into first grade. The proof is that Dean Bell has said we are going to be more selective in our recruitment. Seems he's being true to his word - a ball playing back rower, a winger who has so much more potential then he's displaying, and one of our success stories from the U20s coming back. There's a lot of spaces open to upgrade players here. In business sometimes you have to follow your strategy even when things look gloomy. To me, that's what the Warriors have done. They believed in Cleary despite 2009. They said they'd be selective with their recruitment. They have done so. So in that sense I think one guy who is a completely unsung hero is Scurrah.

Good times are ahead for this club.
 

Lego_Man_old

Guest
I still rank 2008 as our most successful year in the Cleary era.

That Storm game and then visions of a skinny, pale Kirk streak away with that intercept against the Roosters are still vivid in my mind.

'07 was just a **** tease year - finish 4th then 2 finals losses.

Overall, the Cleary-phobes (you know who you are) - need to take a look at the big picture. Bringing through the youngsters as appropriate. Recruiting on the improve (at least in theory) - we have actual first graders coming to the club. And not afraid to make a big call or two, while it could have been handled with a little more care, the Mannering captaincy decision I believe has turned out to be the correct one - whether Price had played or not.

Seasons with a team disqualified are always a bit of a lottery. Look at 02 - going into the final round there were like 4 teams who could have won the Minor Premiership. In the end we jagged it on other results.

So its pretty hard to make a comparison when we could be finishing 4th-8th depending on "bees dick" measurements like points differential. Another team getting flogged in Round 26 and being forced below us doesnt imply that holistically we have become better, or worse if it's other way round.

Maybe a better measure is to look at the W/L record, defence and attack stats in isolation...and the quality and style of football played in the season. I know this is a massive call...but perhaps the Price injury was a blessing in disguise for the club? We now have 3 young, hungry front row boppers who have had a taste of responsibility - Ivan has sent them to take the world on.

The mental side appears to have strenghtened considerably...streets apart from the Panthers flogging i attended earlier in the season. Of late ive noticed Mannering seemingly become more comfortable in his role, on and off the field. With regards to leadership, you've got Mannering, Luck and Tate as the dominant forces and then on the next level guys like Packer and Maloney, who i'd call "young leaders". Maloney is a hot head, but you can see he has passion for his team. I hope the Axis of Laziness can be absorbed into the team next year and that we can bring out the best in them (and not have them drag the side down with ego).

Lastly, although ive got an axe to grind about the fullback and hooker positions, i admit that this club's achilles heel - player (esp. youth) development - looks to be coming good. Most of the forward pack is basically Warrior-developed product. We have had to buy halves, but their ongoing development will reflect our efforts. And anyway, there's a difference between buying an established NRL player and a greenhorn like Maloney. Encouragingly there is also some quality talent building up in the Under 20's that will maintain pressure spots.

All in all, the next 3 years i think are looking the brightest of any era for the Warriors...
 

Iafeta_old

Guest
Seasons with a team disqualified are always a bit of a lottery. Look at 02 - going into the final round there were like 4 teams who could have won the Minor Premiership. In the end we jagged it on other results.

So its pretty hard to make a comparison when we could be finishing 4th-8th depending on "bees dick" measurements like points differential. Another team getting flogged in Round 26 and being forced below us doesnt imply that holistically we have become better, or worse if it's other way round.

Maybe a better measure is to look at the W/L record, defence and attack stats in isolation...and the quality and style of football played in the season. I know this is a massive call...but perhaps the Price injury was a blessing in disguise for the club? We now have 3 young, hungry front row boppers who have had a taste of responsibility - Ivan has sent them to take the world on.

The mental side appears to have strenghtened considerably...streets apart from the Panthers flogging i attended earlier in the season. Of late ive noticed Mannering seemingly become more comfortable in his role, on and off the field. With regards to leadership, you've got Mannering, Luck and Tate as the dominant forces and then on the next level guys like Packer and Maloney, who i'd call "young leaders". Maloney is a hot head, but you can see he has passion for his team. I hope the Axis of Laziness can be absorbed into the team next year and that we can bring out the best in them (and not have them drag the side down with ego).

Lastly, although ive got an axe to grind about the fullback and hooker positions, i admit that this club's achilles heel - player (esp. youth) development - looks to be coming good. Most of the forward pack is basically Warrior-developed product. We have had to buy halves, but their ongoing development will reflect our efforts. And anyway, there's a difference between buying an established NRL player and a greenhorn like Maloney. Encouragingly there is also some quality talent building up in the Under 20's that will maintain pressure spots.

All in all, the next 3 years i think are looking the brightest of any era for the Warriors...

I've said this a few times, and I thoroughly agree. This is part of why I rate this season so much. Because irrespective of what happens in the finals, a large list of guys have had to stand up and be counted ahead of where they probably expected to be. Ben Matulino has to be one of the most improved forwards going around. If Price wasn't injured, if Rapira hadn't have gone down, would Ben Matulino have moved into the front row? I for one am sure glad he did... he gets 10 metres everytime, can offload a little more securely in the middle third, and just as importantly, he reminds me a bit of David Gillespie in that when you get hit by Matulino, you stay hit.
 

Lego_Man_old

Guest
Oh yes - and that "beautiful win" we had over the Panthers away, that one victory meant more to us than a whole wasted season (2009). That'll live long in my memory, the forging (or reforging?) of a team.
 

Fazz_old

Guest
This year has been awesome tbh.
We've had what, 2 floggings and been pretty good for most of the rest of the year.
Not only that, young guys have had banner years, Packer, Rapira, Matulino all showing that they could be mainstays in the Kiwis team. Thats one of the real positives for me, more kiwis in the team, not that I hate Aussies, i'd just rather see guys like Mark Ioane in the mix next year the guys like Brett White. Hopefully in the next few years our team can be 75-85% homegrown. The talent is there for sure.
Even Cleary has stepped up his game, how often this year has he made the RIGHT decision on either dropping or promoting someone? Sure theres the odd case of "how is Lillyman/Royal in the team?" But comparing it to when Rovelli has in the team constantly, times are good. Since both Royal and Lillyman have been good enough players (most of the time, they have had some howlers)

I think last year taught cleary a lot about player selection and I think it taught the players a fair bit and probably put some fire in their bellies.

On a side note, how good was it to see a halves/hooker/fullback combo all playing well last night? It's been a bloody long time since the Warriors have had all of those positions firing...
 

sebastian_old

Guest
Just on 2010, would you say with our hardcore injury toll, taking into account where we end up on the ladder, that Cleary has put in a "Coach Of The Year" performance. I believed he's being doing a good job for a while, however has it been good enough for an award? Which coach has done a better job than Cleary? There was a point where we couldn't win without Price & with half the 1st grade team out for a fair portion of the season has Cleary pulled off an award winning performance?
 

Spence_old

Guest
Just on 2010, would you say with our hardcore injury toll, taking into account where we end up on the ladder, that Cleary has put in a "Coach Of The Year" performance. I believed he's being doing a good job for a while, however has it been good enough for an award? Which coach has done a better job than Cleary? There was a point where we couldn't win without Price & with half the 1st grade team out for a fair portion of the season has Cleary pulled off an award winning performance?

I think he would have to be up there, but to be honest, I'd go Brian Smith. I think the turn around he has done at the Roosters is greater than our turn around from last year.
 

Lego_Man_old

Guest
Funny thing is, Roosters could still miss the 8.

We'll see how deep either team can go into the finals for the "moral title". Though the actual Dally M will be decided before then...
 

Lego_Man_old

Guest
Tallis is on the Toyota Cup footage at the moment, and though he can barely speak coherently (he called James Malonely), he said we've got the best bench in the comp, and was generally jizzing over us.