Post Match [Round 19, 2022] - Raiders vs Warriors Post Match Discussion

[Wrighty]

Another positive from last night is that Chanel Harris-Tavita excelled.
There is a maxim "you are good at what you enjoy and enjoy what you are good at"
Chanel Harris-Tavita was lost as a half but really is quite decent as a fullback.
If he keeps excelling at full back in the next few games. He may change his mind about quitting the NRL next season. I can really see that happening if they keep him at fullback.

A back line next year with him at full back and maybe Charnze Nicoll-Klokstad at centres is starts to sound quite useful.

 

[Wrighty]

I thought and think Walsh being in the team is pointless if at FB and not wing. He doesnt have the defense of a FB and too use him effectively, you need Johnson to do his diaganol run at the centre to draw and pass with a cut out which should leave the winger a chance to flank the opposition wing, but only if they have blinding speed, which neither of our wings have.

Given our place on the table, I think trying to get our team in a positive mind set for NZ so our new coach has a good place to start on the team mentally, to get the most out of them. I do not see Walsh being part of that. I dont agree with Corey Parker that its BS or Spite, its simply Walsh isnt staying so not much point investing time in him in another position. I think Chanel Harris-Tavita should stay, he has been so solid at FB in comparison to Walsh over the 4 games hes played at the back, I feel like we missed a trick not playing him back there given his best attribute is his defnense. So for me, Id rather we try to be positive by having the best defense we can.

Thats just my take on him. I never rated him and he just got worse, what I did like was that he was going to honour is contract and give NZ a go, now that was pissed on I have zero interest in worrying about him. His defense is now the Broncos problem to resolve, if they can, they may have another fast quality FB.

The 2nd 4020 pissed me off, Im not sure why we werent expecting it, given Wightman had actually tried a 3rd one in between those 2. What annoys me more is that given their OBs were up, we didnt give it a go as Shaun Johnson, Asi and Chanel Harris-Tavita can all kick 40/20s. Bizarre. Also given we were struggling to get field position in 2nd half, that is one of the best ways to achieve it, but you need to practise it and have a set play for it etc.....

Thanks brother
I would like to see Walsh named at 6 this week or left right out of the team. Waste of a bench spot.

 

[Beastmode]

Just after I highlighted this yesterday as the key to the clubs motivation to give 100% intensity 80 minutes every game, Harris goes and repeats it in the post conf :"Everyone's just got to look themselves in the mirror and ask if this is what they really want, what they want to get out of their career, and what they want to do for this club."

Now this is great stuff and what Im talking about with the players being accountable for pride in their performance, for their team (also country given its 1 NZ team) and each other, let alone the fans. That is the only way you can produce 80 minutes of 100% effort for 24 rounds. There is no magic bullet or super coach who can fix the Warriors, its a club and player culture problem (not that they are alone with this problem). Its not that they do not have enough talent to be in the top 4. And if they think going back to NZ and hiding with no NRL media scrutiny is going to help, it wont, it will only see them individually get dropped (hopefully). All the coach can ask from players who are signed and then selected for the Club, is use this personal pride as motivation to give 100% 80 minutes, 24 games a season. That is how you make grand finals consistently.

Well said Tohu Harris, I hope you learn to start cracking the pride whip a lot more as captain, no better way to motivate than ask people is that really all you got.

NRL 2022: Tohu Harris' harsh message for teammates as NZ Warriors capitulate against Canberra Raiders

The Kiwi club let in 26 unanswered points after holding a 14-0 lead on Saturday.

www.newshub.co.nz

If we’re being honest, some will say getting paid to provide for the family is why they play.

Winning is not that important. Paycheck is.

What is your counter to that ?

KPI to get into top 8 and you get a 20k bonus? 😋 100k if you help us win a GF? 😴

Sorry I answered my own question 😂 🙋🏻‍♂️

 

[Mr Brownstone]

Another positive from last night is that Chanel Harris-Tavita excelled.
There is a maxim "you are good at what you enjoy and enjoy what you are good at"
Chanel Harris-Tavita was lost as a half but really is quite decent as a fullback.
If he keeps excelling at full back in the next few games. He may change his mind about quitting the NRL next season. I can really see that happening if they keep him at fullback.

A back line next year with him at full back and maybe Charnze Nicoll-Klokstad at centres is starts to sound quite useful.

Excel is hardly the word that springs to mind when I reflect on Chanel Harris-Tavita at fullback. I thought Teddy excelled at fullback in Friday against the Knights. Latrell had his moments last night also. However I don’t recall any key plays from Chanel Harris-Tavita where he was excelling as a fullback, perhaps I missed them. Run me through exactly where you thought he excelled?

 

[Beastmode]

Excel is hardly the word that springs to mind when I reflect on Chanel Harris-Tavita at fullback. I thought Teddy excelled at fullback in Friday against the Knights. Latrell had his moments last night also. However I don’t recall any key plays from Chanel Harris-Tavita where he was excelling as a fullback, perhaps I missed them. Run me through exactly where you thought he excelled?

He was serviceable but hardly anything to write home about in his diary. ✍️

 

[AusWarriorsFan]

If we’re being honest, some will say getting paid to provide for the family is why they play.

Winning is not that important. Paycheck is.

What is your counter to that ?

I would say they can get on the dole and struggle to live as an alternative to not giving 100% if pride in themselves is not enough motivation. Because there are a LOT of players ready to take their spots.

I do understand your point, but to get to NRL level you have to be a pretty damn good player, especially in Australia where expectations start very young. So to be able to get to that level you must love the game, its that simple, there must be a reason why you sacrifice so much just to throw a ball around (sport really is just a game) as an adult.

So there is pride in there, its about how you harness pride, which is the precursor to motivation which is the precursor to intensity. Its a bit like branch chain hormones, one creates the next.

The issue is harnessing self pride. Bellamy does it well with the rip them apart then rebuild them better, bigger, faster etc.

The problem with money being a motivator is the Warriors end up becoming a club where players come to relax, pre-retire retirement.

If players want more money the answer is the same as every club, perform 100% every game and you will soon become an in demand player. Money is a self driven prophecy, so there really isnt a need for bonuses etc. It is also too hard to manage a salary cap that way.

What the Warriors need to do now is start ejecting the "rocks or diamonds" players if they cannot deliver the intensity consistently, because they can, its a choice. Every player will have a few games a season they wish they could play again, but consistency is more about the decision to try and give it all, rather than whether you succeed or not.

Simply do the job at 100% or leave.

That is how I see it, and basically why there are not bonuses etc in the league (not the ones we know about anyway ;-p). The bonuses are, if you play consistently well, you become in demand, which means you get paid a lot more potentially.

 

[Tim burgess]

Excel is hardly the word that springs to mind when I reflect on Chanel Harris-Tavita at fullback. I thought Teddy excelled at fullback in Friday against the Knights. Latrell had his moments last night also. However I don’t recall any key plays from Chanel Harris-Tavita where he was excelling as a fullback, perhaps I missed them. Run me through exactly where you thought he excelled?

Chanel Harris-Tavita is a stop gap player in the position and do an adequate job. Would he be full back at other clubs possibly not.

The positives is that he's not making mistakes, but attacking wise is offering very little.

 

[Once A Warrior]

Geez our forward stats make for grim reading.

Aitken, 23 meters
Curran 8 meters
Afoa 69 meters
Murchie 49 meters
Katoa 39 meters.

Is that the second half? Or whole game! 😬

 

[Canadian_WarriorFan]

Is that the second half? Or whole game! 😬

Whole game unfortunately.

 

[Beastmode]

I would say they can get on the dole and struggle to live as an alternative to not giving 100% if pride in themselves is not enough motivation. Because there are a LOT of players ready to take their spots.

I do understand your point, but to get to NRL level you have to be a pretty damn good player, especially in Australia where expectations start very young. So to be able to get to that level you must love the game, its that simple, there must be a reason why you sacrifice so much just to throw a ball around (sport really is just a game) as an adult.

So there is pride in there, its about how you harness pride, which is the precursor to motivation which is the precursor to intensity. Its a bit like branch chain hormones, one creates the next.

The issue is harnessing self pride. Bellamy does it well with the rip them apart then rebuild them better, bigger, faster etc.

The problem with money being a motivator is the Warriors end up becoming a club where players come to relax, pre-retire retirement.

If players want more money the answer is the same as every club, perform 100% every game and you will soon become an in demand player. Money is a self driven prophecy, so there really isnt a need for bonuses etc. It is also too hard to manage a salary cap that way.

What the Warriors need to do now is start ejecting the "rocks or diamonds" players if they cannot deliver the intensity consistently, because they can, its a choice. Every player will have a few games a season they wish they could play again, but consistency is more about the decision to try and give it all, rather than whether you succeed or not.

Simply do the job at 100% or leave.

That is how I see it, and basically why there are not bonuses etc in the league (not the ones we know about anyway ;-p). The bonuses are, if you play consistently well, you become in demand, which means you get paid a lot more potentially.

Well I think if alpha had a few brown paper bags stuffed with cash and gave it out every time the team won we might win a few more games

 

[AusWarriorsFan]

Excel is hardly the word that springs to mind when I reflect on Chanel Harris-Tavita at fullback. I thought Teddy excelled at fullback in Friday against the Knights.

Fair point, I think Wrighty just meant in relation to a traditional FB role of defense, vs the modern FB which is a mix of that and a traditional wingers pace (which is what Teddy possesses)

Chanel Harris-Tavita is not a marquees FB, but for a player 4 games into his NRL FB career, he did pretty darn good. For me I would say defusing their bombs was the big one over how many times we have dropped bombs this year. Never taking his eye off the footy, even when taken out mid air. Reasonable metres, decent post contact metres, 3 tackle breaks, kicks defused 2, Tackles 15, Missed 2

He had a pretty good game at FB defensively. Which is the exact reason Jones chose him over Walsh. Its really no surprise given hes one of the best defenders in the team, what is surprising is how long it took to try him out there. He also retains the kicking option, which the Warriors have 4 with Asi playing (Shaun Johnson, Asi, Chanel Harris-Tavita, Egan). Which again, given how big a boot the first 3 have, why the 40/20 wasnt attempted when we were camped on our goal line. Asi was noted by Jones for his attacking kicks. Hopefully next game when under the pump they keep it as an option, because no doubt Melb will have us camped on our try line haha.

The Broncos have a LOT of work if they think Walsh is going to be insta FB. Its not just that his defensive stats have not improved, his offense is next to non existent now. But thats what happens when you pick a speedy half to play FB without checking out their defensive capability first. I guess similar could be said of putting halves into hooker like with Egan, but thankfully he is starting to come right.

 

[Defence]

Excel is hardly the word that springs to mind when I reflect on Chanel Harris-Tavita at fullback. I thought Teddy excelled at fullback in Friday against the Knights. Latrell had his moments last night also. However I don’t recall any key plays from Chanel Harris-Tavita where he was excelling as a fullback, perhaps I missed them. Run me through exactly where you thought he excelled?

Must’ve missed the pukana….. 😝

 

[Wrighty]

Fair point, I think Wrighty just meant in relation to a traditional FB role of defense, vs the modern FB which is a mix of that and a traditional wingers pace (which is what Teddy possesses)

Chanel Harris-Tavita is not a marquees FB, but for a player 4 games into his NRL FB career, he did pretty darn good. For me I would say defusing their bombs was the big one over how many times we have dropped bombs this year. Never taking his eye off the footy, even when taken out mid air. Reasonable metres, decent post contact metres, 3 tackle breaks, kicks defused 2, Tackles 15, Missed 2

He had a pretty good game at FB defensively. Which is the exact reason Jones chose him over Walsh. Its really no surprise given hes one of the best defenders in the team, what is surprising is how long it took to try him out there. He also retains the kicking option, which the Warriors have 4 with Asi playing (Shaun Johnson, Asi, Chanel Harris-Tavita, Egan). Which again, given how big a boot the first 3 have, why the 40/20 wasnt attempted when we were camped on our goal line. Asi was noted by Jones for his attacking kicks. Hopefully next game when under the pump they keep it as an option, because no doubt Melb will have us camped on our try line haha.

The Broncos have a LOT of work if they think Walsh is going to be insta FB. Its not just that his defensive stats have not improved, his offense is next to non existent now. But thats what happens when you pick a speedy half to play FB without checking out their defensive capability first. I guess similar could be said of putting halves into hooker like with Egan, but thankfully he is starting to come right.

Thanks Brother, Mr Brownstone the above is my answer to what Chanel Harris-Tavita excelled at. He did not excell by NRL standards but by Warriors 2022 standards he excelled.

 

[Wrighty]

Must’ve missed the pukana….. 😝

Is a pukana where you give the Maori tongue challenge? That was mean and the other dude looked intimidated by it. All our guys even the white Aussies should be trained to do it...LOL Joke obviously. But that was possibly the highlight of the match and also a reason why I detected he seemed to enjoy yesterday a lot more than other outings he has made this year.
I have a sneaky $5 note that says he will change his mind and play next year if we keep him at full back for the rest of the season.

 

[Mr Brownstone]

Thanks Brother, Mr Brownstone the above is my answer to what Chanel Harris-Tavita excelled at. He did not excell by NRL standards but by Warriors 2022 standards he excelled.

Ah ok cool understood, relative to Warriors standard of play. So if I was thinking about it from an overall NRL competition perspective then I should switch your use of the word ‘excel’ to ‘mediocre’ or, to split it into two words, ‘below average’. Makes much more sense.

 

[Beastmode]

Thanks Brother, Mr Brownstone the above is my answer to what Chanel Harris-Tavita excelled at. He did not excell by NRL standards but by Warriors 2022 standards he excelled.

Warriors have standards?

That’s a first.


I kid.

 

[AusWarriorsFan]

The positives is that he's not making mistakes, but attacking wise is offering very little.

Yep.

Given we are going to have a 4 halves (not counting Egan who is a real 9 now), fighting for 2 spots, and Metcalf scores some insane tries from long range with pace that doesnt stop over 100m, whether at half or FB, I think its worth a game of putting Walsh on our wing, just to simulate what the cut out pass/overlap to insane pace looks like with Metcalf.

A bit like SoO, sometimes you have to find a spot for your best players. Just not sure which one I'd give a rest, Montoya or D WZ. Probably Dalin, given Montoya is making a lot of hit ups and is also doing a good job defusing kicks.

Im looking at next years team and thinking, if we cannot make the 4 with this team we never will.

You got 3 full backs and all 3 are players I want in the team. For me, Id play Martin at FB and Charnze Nicoll-Klokstad at centre as hes a bit more sizeable. But then there is the extreme pace of Metcalf, you have Shaun Johnson at 7, you have to play Metcalf at 6 given we need X factor and pace, so I presume Volkman slowly fills in for 6 or 7 (even though hes more like Stacey than Shaun Johnson) and Shaun Johnson slowly helps him prepare for the 7 role.....

Walker plays 14, Niukore I presume plays back rower, which for me means we still have a centre spot and IMO it would be silly not to offer Arthars a contract given how consistently good he has been for the Warriors and wants to play for the Warriors and wont get a show in at the Broncs now that they are flying. Which would push Pompey back to our reserve centre, which would be a great option to have, with hopefully Vailea getting some quality defensive coaching and applying it when NRL Reserve Grade starts again next year in earnest.

What Im seeing is a lot of our current rocks or diamonds players, are going to have to fight to retain their spot under healthy competition, which can only help drive motivation.

On paper, its hard to see us doing rubbish again next year. But then I thought that this year on paper. But, there is a lot more experienced first graders next year.

 

[AusWarriorsFan]

Ah ok cool understood, relative to Warriors standard of play. So if I was thinking about it from an overall NRL competition perspective then I should switch your use of the word ‘excel’ to ‘mediocre’ or, to split it into two words, ‘below average’. Makes much more sense.

Or, he had a Walshy of a game on offense and excelled on defense (comparatively) ;-p

It will be interesting to see what the Broncs do next year if they cannot get Walsh to FG FB standards on D. I do not see room in the halves with Mam being a rare find and Reynolds being 80% of their success (Hass being another 15%) Broncs would be shot without Reynolds. He is definitely worth the money, which in the end was nothing close to what he was asking for. Warriors should have flicked him a $4m 3 year deal haha.

 

[Beastmode]

Or, he had a Walshy of a game on offense and excelled on defense (comparatively) ;-p

It will be interesting to see what the Broncs do next year if they cannot get Walsh to FG FB standards on D. I do not see room in the halves with Mam being a rare find and Reynolds being 80% of their success (Hass being another 15%) Broncs would be shot without Reynolds. He is definitely worth the money, which in the end was nothing close to what he was asking for. Warriors should have flicked him a $4m 3 year deal haha.

He plays on the wing.

It’s that simple.

Or the bench.

 

[Peewee]

I thought the first half was good, first ten minutes great, with accuracy and good ball movement. Great scramble in defence on our own line as well.

2nd half, Canberra just demolished us up front got quick play the balls and Starling and Wighton just ripped us apart. We didn’t play poorly, we just don’t have the quality or star power to change momentum.

Good effort and some promise, but some players need to improve and some need to become depth rather than starters.

We need someone to hit the line at pace. A big buggar. our guys get the ball and defence at the same time.