General NRL 2021 Round 5 - General Discussion

Beastmode

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Yeah I guess so. I feel like Bellamy is the only guy who carries enough weight tho. Still just a pipe dream... Just like us winning a prem

If you hiring him with a win now strategy, and a roster he can work with and not take 5 years to "build" then absolutely he is the right guy for the job.

If you're hiring to build a culture here. Forget it.
 
did we let Cleary go or did he leave?
From memory we refused him a 2 year contract, Gus offered him a 5 year plan or something, then sacked him and said that was part of the plan. He's never wrong, Gus.

After that he sacked Hook and the bus crashed and they wanted Ivan back, and Ivan said he'd only come back on the condition that Gus moves to New Zealand.
 
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You’re hitting the core of something much deeper again. It’s been discussed, debated and I’m sure papers written at University. We are all different in one way or another. Human genetics, our surroundings and the people we meet and see on TV. They all influence our behaviour. We have little control over our genetic makeup, especially race. But the stereotyping of Asians being smart, Polynesians with brawn, Caucasian with social adaptation, while highly offensive to some, is a fair reflection of their genetic strengths. Mix two together and you have the potential for greatness. I could write all day about this, but going back up my point. Human behaviour is influenced by many factors. Top of the tree is genetics. Next, societal influence. Kiwis are about as Australian as the English are to Americans. The cultural nuances that have carved our national identity is generational. This isn’t changing anytime soon. Then there’s micro-sub cultures influencing our behaviour. From the TV channels we watch, to the friends we have, right down to the partners we chose in life. All these factors influence our behaviour and mindset. If the Warriors want a cultural change at the club, they need to look at all these ingredients collectively. Not just assume hiring a Gus Gould or a new coach is the answer. Because it clearly is not.
There is a lot packed into this, BM. But if I understand your point that "The cultural nuances that have carved our national identity is generational" then it would follow that what is true in RL is also true in RU and other sports. But not so. Our rugby players, coaches, development systems are Kiwi as, but --I would need to look this up-- we seem to be doing just fine relative to Australia in rugby. And cricket. And hoops. There have to be a variety of other factors at work, and the key is to identify what they are and then, if possible, rectify them. Maybe rugby league people --from the NZW, NZRL on down-- are too close to the problem. Maybe they should ask the rugby, cricket and hoops people for ideas.
 

Mr Frank White

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There is a lot packed into this, BM. But if I understand your point that "The cultural nuances that have carved our national identity is generational" then it would follow that what is true in RL is also true in RU and other sports. But not so. Our rugby players, coaches, development systems are Kiwi as, but --I would need to look this up-- we seem to be doing just fine relative to Australia in rugby. And cricket. And hoops. There have to be a variety of other factors at work, and the key is to identify what they are and then, if possible, rectify them. Maybe rugby league people --from the NZW, NZRL on down-- are too close to the problem. Maybe they should ask the rugby, cricket and hoops people for ideas.
Doesn't NZ suck at cricket these days??
 
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Beastmode

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There is a lot packed into this, BM. But if I understand your point that "The cultural nuances that have carved our national identity is generational" then it would follow that what is true in RL is also true in RU and other sports. But not so. Our rugby players, coaches, development systems are Kiwi as, but --I would need to look this up-- we seem to be doing just fine relative to Australia in rugby. And cricket. And hoops. There have to be a variety of other factors at work, and the key is to identify what they are and then, if possible, rectify them. Maybe rugby league people --from the NZW, NZRL on down-- are too close to the problem. Maybe they should ask the rugby, cricket and hoops people for ideas.

Hang on a minute mate! I think you've taken my point out of context. In no way am I implying the dysfunctional nature of the Warriors is a by-product of our national identity. Far from it, as you have already proven with all other sports that kiwis excel in! I'm saying you have to analyse the collective sum of the parts to better understand how we solve the problem of the Warriors. Comparing them to the AB's is apples to oranges, because the problem case is different. I think the Australian rugby union is better comparison, as they face the same struggles we do as a second tier sport in the country.
 

Beastmode

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Serious Q but. I don't follow much sport apart from NFL/NRL. Last time I followed NZ cricket was like late 90s..

We did all right getting to the 2019 world cup final only to be robbed by England... .cant remember what has happened to us since...

actually i just checked..


we are #2 in the ICC world cup rankings... not too shabby...
 
I think we have more in common with soccer here than Aussie union, we're never going to be world beaters, it's down to the level of competition we're up against with a tiny population v massive numbers on a world scale. I think we generally punch above our weight in both league and soccer, we just need outside help from the best resources available, I'm stocked Gould's committed to help us, who else can? Also the club has a truly proud owner who's passionate about success for once, that must be contributing to positive change. Actually, we just need Josh Reynolds and everything else will take care of itself.
 

Beastmode

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I think we have more in common with soccer here than Aussie union, we're never going to be world beaters, it's down to the level of competition we're up against with a tiny population v massive numbers on a world scale. I think we generally punch above our weight in both league and soccer, we just need outside help from the best resources available, I'm stocked Gould's committed to help us, who else can? Also the club has a truly proud owner who's passionate about success for once, that must be contributing to positive change. Actually, we just need Josh Reynolds and everything else will take care of itself.

You're right. We could learn ALOT from the Wellington Phoenix and how their academy works. My 8 year old was selected to play for the U9's ( and here in Auckland!!) , and they have a massive reputation at grass roots. Their brand name is best in class. We did a trip to Sydney a few years back to play in the Sydney U9's tournament with 2 teams from NZ taking part... Wynton's Rufers team was the other one... absolutely fantastic for Wellington Phoenix as they took out the tournament in dominant style against all the Aussie teams. Although I think the Phoenix academy here in Auckland has now shut, which means the grass root talent are all playing for Auckland United FC... as they should.
 
If you hiring him with a win now strategy, and a roster he can work with and not take 5 years to "build" then absolutely he is the right guy for the job.

If you're hiring to build a culture here. Forget it.
Bellamy would pull players for cheap from everywhere. He can then build a culture and develop the players.

Anyone else is pushing shit uphill trying to get the sort of player they want...
 
Serious Q but. I don't follow much sport apart from NFL/NRL. Last time I followed NZ cricket was like late 90s..
Oh, well you've got a lot to catch up on. They've since invented this form of cricket called T20 which is a bit like Cricket Max, but is more popular. Stephen Fleming finished his test career with an average of 40 in the mid 2000s and can now just rock on up to a six week tournament called the Indian Premier League to coach a few players in exchange for pots of gold. He also gets some pocket money plugging heat pumps.
 
Bellamy would pull players for cheap from everywhere. He can then build a culture and develop the players.

Anyone else is pushing shit uphill trying to get the sort of player they want...

Isn't Bellamy, Robinson and Broncos owned my deep pockets or media conglomerates? I mean that could have something to do with their success.

I wouldn't look into it too much. Money always certainly wins all the time. Everyone else gets crumbs.
 
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Dixpat

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.... If you were to do it though, it would be at the sports academy we set up in Australia (wink wink) - and getting discipline drilled into their psyche early. Trying to teach them by the time they are playing NRL is a waste of time....
If I’m not mistaken 11 of the 18 players listed for the game against Manly have come to us via the Australian system so is it the pathway or something regarding the club?
 
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Beastmode

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If I’m not mistaken 11 of the 18 players listed for the game against Manly have come to us via the Australian system so is it the pathway or something regarding the club?

It would sound much better if it was 11 of the 18 listed having come from New Zealand’s system (based in Australia). The fact half of them are now injured and we have no quality junior stocks to call on is the problem.