Team List Jnr Warriors Vs Jnr Roosters

[¿N. ig-mah¿]

I had to laugh last night at the ref. He seemed to be getting dominated by some of the players. Omar lost it with him a couple of times and the Roosters captain had a go at him about pushing in the scrum. Telling the ref he had never heard of the rule allowing puching once the ball was in, and then having another dig in the next scrum, when you could hear him yell out "Watch it boys, we're playing rugby union now, their going to push".

Omar really overstepped the mark when he screamed at the ref, but the ref just told him to calm down. Later Omar was yelling about one of the Roosters tries not being scored, and the ref telling him he was going to look at it. Omar replies "sorry mate, just trying to help". I'm surprised that these kids get away with disrespecting the refs like that. It something they will need to get in check when they step up to first grade (or rugby in Omar's case). I think some refs are too short with the players, but to allow that sort of thing, that ref would never make it in first grade. There are too many dominant captains in the NRL for him to succeed.

 

[Moz]

So when we appoint a new head coach does he have a say in the recruitment practices for all three teams, the overall style the teams play, the structures attacking and defensive put in place, or are the teams run as 3 seperate entities.

 

[slaughterhouse.sa]

Have to say it dude. Some of the things that youve said in this post (highlighted in bold) are just plain silly!

Omar was being courted by numerous NRL clubs including the Warriors for his signature which says to me that he wasnt 'rubbish' at all. A fairer assessment would have been to say that he had a great career at Fullback with the U20's and was instrumental in them winning 2 Premierships but last night wasnt his best game.

John Ackland has, since taking over from Tony Iro, transformed this team into the form team of the competition. Other teams will always come and go but the Warriors have managed to be highly competitive for 3 straight seasons. He took over in 2010 and they won it that year and last year. Came 2nd this season with a largely new team. Your comment about him being a 'fraud' is not only incorrect but grossly disrespectful and not based on any logical reasoning.

Tony Iro has been the U20 coach and never did as well as Ackland. Steve Kearney has done a full apprenticeship with Craig Bellamy, coached the Eels (though not very well!) and is the current Kiwis coach. Do you seriously think he would accept a coaching position for the U20's? And Tim Sheens, winner of 4 Premierships, current coach of the Tigers and mentor of League stars Benji Marshall and Robbie Farrar to accept a demotion to NYC... speechless!

I understand you may have been a little sore after the loss and possibly drunk but theres no place here for the type of mindless post that you just produced. Try put some thought into your posts and if your using lol in them then its probably not a wothwhile one anyway... lol!

I still stand on my opinion on Omar - and it wasnt based on this season but the past couple of years.
Yes he had potential - but could not play rugby league - particularly didnt have the basic skillset to play in the fullback position.
The frustrating thing is that could have been coached into him. We could of added some ability to run fullback lines, I.e not randomly across the field off killing play.
We could of added the ability to play make even if it is a basic level.

To a lesser degree - I am worried about Bishop will face the same fate - He too has clearly ability to fend and break the line.
But will need to learn some more tricks of the trade and cement a fixed position to really see his true development.
But what will happen - is that the coach will praise everytime he breaks the line - he wont develop the other schools

Same thing with Taylor - will he be told to stop doing weights so much and increase mobility and endurance. i.e areas of improvement.
Same thing with Havili - will he be told he needs to stay under 100kg and dropped if he turns back next season overweight.

Toka - He could of been a good player, He hasnt played a real game of league all-year.Instead of making him get in shape, or play a real game of footy.It is going to be a massive learning curve for him - if he wants progress. My point - the warriors have on whole being a disservice to him.

I might seem harsh on these young players - but they need people raising expectations and guiding them.
Getting them NRL ready as soon as possible - so when called upon they are read to go (as possible)

I was taking this pi$$ regarding Sheens and Ricky Henry - my real point I dont rate Ackland as the coach of the 20s - I would accept any decent replacement.
Major changes are needed - as to calling him fraud - I still stand with that - He was shown up by the dumb football he has instilled in the team from day dot. That has always been my opinion.
Not a knee jerk reaction.

As for Ricky Henry - I still rate Ricky Henry higher despite his success or lack thereof with the vulcans. Again - my point I would take anybody else that is decent.
It aint the hardest gig to take on - People fail to recognise the Ricky ran the warriors development - which has given the 20s the best players to choose from in the competition.
The vulcans were a shambles this year - but watch next year with the warriors taking them over (i expect the vulcans brand gone) they will ace it.

I was not drunk at all - frustrated yes - but I still stand with my opinions and you can doubt write me off all you want.
But there will be major changes with the 20s and vulcans next year. Bell and or the head coach will take over some leadership and prohibit some of the short-sighted win at all cost decisions that ackland has been making. Some of the my frustration will then be eased.

 

[slaughterhouse.sa]

So when we appoint a new head coach does he have a say in the recruitment practices for all three teams, the overall style the teams play, the structures attacking and defensive put in place, or are the teams run as 3 seperate entities.

Well bluey was bum-chums with ackland.
So he probably didnt say anything - but we all know he didnt say anything when he kn
He was probably too nice.

But my whole arguement that yes - both Bell (or replacement) and the new head coach.
Should have some input and the overall power.

The nyc coach will get to choose a few players he rates - however the final call comes from Development Manager and Head coach.
This is something the warriors have failed to do and have suffered as a result.

I garuntee that this will remedied at the end of the year. With their jobs on the line - they will have too.

ie Winning Under 20s is not the goal.
tbh they can still win the competition, with development of players being the main priority

 

[slaughterhouse.sa]

Lack of structure has been pointed out above. What I can't fathom is a total lack of a game plan - they looked totally at a loss on the 5th tackle.

Takeiaho taking the kicks? Stupid. Nobody was talking, they really miss Henry.
Yes, they missed Carlos, but I don't think he would have changed the game.

My real concern is that these kids are the club's future and I don't believe they are getting the best grounding for first grade.
Roll on the Academy, or is that just talk too?

Agreed.

also - If the same people are in charge of the NYC team and the structures to remain the same.
Also So much of the development is done while playing footy, also halve the issue were the selections & structures.

However, one thing they overlooked in that announcenemnt?They already have the best young players

They do need to improve the quality of their development/academy
Basically to ensure to player arent getting all treated the same.

I know some of the young blokes have been in the development for years, still cant lift weights or still majorily unfit.
I think with a slightly better system and more people involved - that stuff wont fly under the radar.

 

[Moz]

Agreed.

I know some of the young blokes have been in the development for years, still cant lift weights or still majorily unfit.
I think with a slightly better system and more people involved - that stuff wont fly under the radar.

yesterday looked like a few guys had lifted a shitload of weights building beach muscles but didnt know how to kick, didnt know when too pass what lines to run??? I think Wayne Bennets right the games producing too many athletes and not enough footballers

 

[slaughterhouse.sa]

yesterday looked like a few guys had lifted a shitload of weights building beach muscles but didnt know how to kick, didnt know when too pass what lines to run??? I think Wayne Bennets right the games producing too many athletes and not enough footballers

Yeah my point though - is that each of these blokes in the acadamey, need to work on different areas - cookie cutter approach wont work.
Those players who dont get that development in those 15-17 years of age - you dont see them on the tv.

They come of age - then guys like ackland/bell are too small etc. But wait they have been in your development system for three years - so whose fault is it.

I think we can have athletes who can play football.

 

[facefacts]

I'm sure you will come back with how you are the only one with the league knowledge to have any real opinion about the Juniors, but I have to disagree with you on 2 counts.

To say Ackland is a crap coach and should be replaced by Ricky Henry is total bollocks. How can you deny 2 premierships and a finals berth in the last 3 seasons. How did Henry go this year???

And again you talking crap saying Omar has never been any good. His recent form has not been good at all, but he still has a phenominal try scoring strike rate over 3 seasons (almost a try a game), and before this year, his defence and reading of the game were exceptional.

Pull out all the big words and insults, about how I only know what I am told, you want, but you will never convince me to agree with your opinion on these two things, and I am quite suspect on many of your other opinions. You sound a little like facefacts when he gets hung up on something (like Manu).

The difference being, most of the league watching world are of the same opinion these days about that particular subject....by the way, great call on Omar. Lucky you were right about Locke, because you've been wrong about pretty much everything else you drone on about.

 

[¿N. ig-mah¿]

The difference being, most of the league watching world are of the same opinion these days about that particular subject....by the way, great call on Omar. Lucky you were right about Locke, because you've been wrong about pretty much everything else you drone on about.

Examples please? I actually thought Omar was one the first calls I have made that hasn't panned out.

I would still have liked to see him get a small contract with us and spend an off-season at wing. I put his form slump down to the pressures of contract negotiations. I saw nothing any different to many other players trying to play first grade wing with limilted experience. Locke and Fish both had games very much like Omar. And it is difficult to shine when you are only given the ball in pointless positions, as Ben Henry and Lewis Brown are prone to do.

I haven't seen anything to show the "league watching world" have shifted their opinion to anything even vaguely resembling your opinion of a certain large Polynesian winger.

 

[mt.wellington]

I might seem harsh on these young players - but they need people raising expectations and guiding them.
Getting them NRL ready as soon as possible - so when called upon they are read to go (as possible)

I was taking this pi$$ regarding Sheens and Ricky Henry - my real point I dont rate Ackland as the coach of the 20s - I would accept any decent replacement.
Major changes are needed - as to calling him fraud - I still stand with that - He was shown up by the dumb football he has instilled in the team from day dot. That has always been my opinion.
Not a knee jerk reaction.

As for Ricky Henry - I still rate Ricky Henry higher despite his success or lack thereof with the vulcans. Again - my point I would take anybody else that is decent.
It aint the hardest gig to take on - People fail to recognise the Ricky ran the warriors development - which has given the 20s the best players to choose from in the competition.
The vulcans were a shambles this year - but watch next year with the warriors taking them over (i expect the vulcans brand gone) they will ace it.

I was not drunk at all - frustrated yes - but I still stand with my opinions and you can doubt write me off all you want.
But there will be major changes with the 20s and vulcans next year. Bell and or the head coach will take over some leadership and prohibit some of the short-sighted win at all cost decisions that ackland has been making. Some of the my frustration will then be eased.

I agree with you to an extent about Ackland. In terms of 'winning' he's a great coach and with the wealth of talent and early puberty size of the polynesian players at his disposal he will no doubt deliver another 5 Premiership in the next decade. A huge concern of mine and other posters by the looks of things is the lack of development these players are receiving. I've posted similar concerns earlier and the example I used was the Brisbane Broncos development of players. Their U20 team dont really trouble teams like the Warriors too much and came 12th this year winning 9 games and losing 15. They came 9th last season and 10th the year before. Whats really interesting about their U20 teams is the age of some of the playersand the how they send most of their 19-20 year old players to one of their 3 feeder clubs in the Queensland Intrust Super Cup (Northern Suburbs Devils, Redcliffe Dolphins and Wynnum Manly Seagulls). With this type of pathway its little wonder they produce better young players, arguably the best developed players in the competition with the likes of Beale, Hoffman and Alex Glenn to name afew. Raiders U20 graduates from the 2008 Premiership winning team are only now shining for the club.

Anyway, my point is, shouldnt the U20's really be about the NRL team? And if so, are we really going to be happy to sacrifice our 'winning' culture at the U20 level to help develop a better end result for the main NRL team?

 

[Moz]

Yeah my point though - is that each of these blokes in the acadamey, need to work on different areas - cookie cutter approach wont work.
Those players who dont get that development in those 15-17 years of age - you dont see them on the tv.

They come of age - then guys like ackland/bell are too small etc. But wait they have been in your development system for three years - so whose fault is it.

I think we can have athletes who can play football.

I hear ya and while i genuinely hope your right, I think the clubs is in need of footballers, guys with football smarts learnt from a young age already there prior to and then honed at NYC level not taught there, obviously there will be exceptions. We need guys in both juniors and seniors who make the right decisions under pressure or have the ability to read the game in front of them as it unfolds either that or you have to resort to totally regimented structures. But whatever you decide seems it would benefit all involved if you have some kind of uniformity between the teams.

Also am confused as to the function of the Vulcans is it a possible pathway into first grade or a dumping ground for rejects, do Vulcans players have motivation to excell, something to aspire too?

 

[slaughterhouse.sa]

I agree with you to an extent about Ackland. In terms of 'winning' he's a great coach and with the wealth of talent and early puberty size of the polynesian players at his disposal he will no doubt deliver another 5 Premiership in the next decade. A huge concern of mine and other posters by the looks of things is the lack of development these players are receiving. I've posted similar concerns earlier and the example I used was the Brisbane Broncos development of players. Their U20 team dont really trouble teams like the Warriors too much and came 12th this year winning 9 games and losing 15. They came 9th last season and 10th the year before. Whats really interesting about their U20 teams is the age of some of the playersand the how they send most of their 19-20 year old players to one of their 3 feeder clubs in the Queensland Intrust Super Cup (Northern Suburbs Devils, Redcliffe Dolphins and Wynnum Manly Seagulls). With this type of pathway its little wonder they produce better young players, arguably the best developed players in the competition with the likes of Beale, Hoffman and Alex Glenn to name afew. Raiders U20 graduates from the 2008 Premiership winning team are only now shining for the club.

Anyway, my point is, shouldnt the U20's really be about the NRL team? And if so, are we really going to be happy to sacrifice our 'winning' culture at the U20 level to help develop a better end result for the main NRL team?

Yes, at the very least the 20s should be about the development of players - in light of the NRL team.

Who says you have to sacrifice a winning culture - Who say the only way they can win by playing dumb football?
by having 120kg wingers, having two 100kg hookers and playing with one halfback.

Have certain standards and strcutures employed at NYC level - raise the ability, skill and overall knoweledge of the game at 20s level.

Broncos traditionally have been a good example, however I feel they might have strayed too far away from the 20s a little.
At the very least do it like the roosters - who have given both Roger Tuivasa-Sheck, Dylan Napa and Kane Evans all at least 3+ in NSW cup to give them a taste.
Guys like Omar and Carlos - could of done with footy at NSW Cup level - in a position they have a future at the club in. I.e not 6 (carlos) or 1 (omar)

 

[warriors8]

U20's ripped off by travel. They finished on top of Canberra yet played in Canberra coz Canberra 1st Grade in Top 8. Then because they lost they came home then travelled back again to Sydney which would really be a home game for the Roosters so finishing 2nd in the comp did them no favors at all. Why didnt they just stay in Sydney? The Club hard up for $? Being the 2 time U20's champs you think the club would do more. I think that since the first grade bombed out badly in 2012, the club would of pulled out all the stops to make sure the U20's had the best possible chance to get 3 in a row. Then again they only the Under 20's aye!! Warriors Management shouldnt forget that the Under 20's are the only team in the franchise that has really brought home the bacon, twice!!

 

[slaughterhouse.sa]

U20's ripped off by travel. They finished on top of Canberra yet played in Canberra coz Canberra 1st Grade in Top 8. Then because they lost they came home then travelled back again to Sydney which would really be a home game for the Roosters so finishing 2nd in the comp did them no favors at all. Why didnt they just stay in Sydney? The Club hard up for $? Being the 2 time U20's champs you think the club would do more. I think that since the first grade bombed out badly in 2012, the club would of pulled out all the stops to make sure the U20's had the best possible chance to get 3 in a row. Then again they only the Under 20's aye!! Warriors Management shouldnt forget that the Under 20's are the only team in the franchise that has really brought home the bacon, twice!!

Mate - good theory and the travel wasnt ideal. But it had absolutely nothing do with the result.

The NYC cant stay a week - its against the rules of NYC to be working or go to university.They arent allowed during the day - in a working week.
The players have families, university or work commitments.

 

[mt.wellington]

Mate - good theory and the travel wasnt ideal. But it had absolutely nothing do with the result.

The NYC cant stay a week - its against the rules of NYC to be working or go to university.They arent allowed during the day - in a working week.
The players have families, university or work commitments.

Much the same as the top side who prefer to come home and be with family then stay over in Oz. Unless theyre playing the Titans the next week!?!

 

[mode81]

Just goes to show the cool calm mindset Ben Henry brought to his team mates over the years he played NYC. No disrespect to Palavi but Henry was a great captain for these young blokes when he played NYC they looked balanced structured and calm under pressure. This season's young Warriors seemed like they were walking a tightrope for a long time, they finally fell off at finals time no desperation to get across the line or work for eachother defensively seriously disjointed but that's footy.

 

[Lord Gnome of Howick MBE]

This years U20s appeared not to be coached particularly well - the commentator on Saturday summed it up as "12 forwards and a fullback".

 

[charlie bobmarley]

Omar & others spend too much time checking themselves out on the big-screen. Surely they have lived in the western world long enough to have seen a television.

 

[Sup42]

I imagine that part of the expense of Bellamy at the Warriors would be a new Juniors Coach.

They rant on about their systems at Melbourne and If I were Craig I would want complete control of coaching staff and not have to reinvent the wheel for the underlings.

It might be that with the reputed best Jnr talent pool going that you would overlook the premierships won by Ackland.

On a side note if their is a silver lining to come from not winning this year it could be that the Review decides relying on being a development club exclusively may not in fact be a simple waiting game for results in first grade.

Might lend more weight to buying in some experienced players.

 

[Inruin]

Reported Junior Warriors have trashed their hotl in Sydney after the game. Police were called and they were thrown out of the hotel they were staying in. Warriors have apparently offered to pay damages and repremanded players involved. perfect finish to the season. how have we gone so far backwards?