General Club Culture At The Warriors - Is There A Problem?

[¿N. ig-mah¿]

The most dangerous statement made publicly by a Warrior isn't the stupid tweet stuff including the not being happy that Tony Iro missed out Tweets.

It was the " Half backs are not always going to agree with coaches " stuff that Johnson rattled off.

It's not an offensive thing or even disrespectful from Shaun Johnson , it's his honest opinion.

The fact that he feels confident enough to voice that to reporters says to me that he thinks it's ok to put his own ideas first and the game plan secound.

That's not new to our club , our legend is players who add lib and play what is in front of them.

But none of those players felt comfortable telling the media that they aren't always going to agree with their coach.

Why ? because it's about chain of command and following orders , giving the appearance of delivering on a game plan that the coach is part of / has ultimate say in.

Where does it come from ?

- I would hazard a guess that part of it is Johnsons personality make up , part is his experiences in the U20's ( a GF win will shape your thinking )

Something else to consider ....throw in their .........

Remember when Andrew Johns disagreed with Phil Goulds Origin plans ?

Gus shocked the Sydney media by dropping the best player in the world because of a battle of wills between the two.

Andrew Johns is now our very own halfbacks mentor / hero / role model and advisor.

Joey got his own way in the end to some degre when he remade Origin selection in spite of fractious relations with his coach

" Half backs don't always agree with coaches " can you imagine Johns telling Shaun Johnson to back himself , be his own man on the field ?

The difference between Johns and his protege is that Johns was the best player in the world.

The other difference in the Elliot Johnson relationship is that Phil Gould actually dropped Johns until they had an understanding.

Shaun Johnson could be as great as Sam Tomkins , he has the talent , he is short on some core skills and most of them come from the top two inches and learning that the team is the coaches men , and the team is greater than any one individual.....thereby Halfbacks are compelled to agree with their coaches on fifth tackle decisions.

I have discussed this very topic with a work mate in depth. He is a huge Johnson fan, while he labels me a hater. I have wasted so many hours trying (God knows why) to convince him that I don't hate Shaun Johnson, but simply want him to be producing his amazing skills regularly and frequesntly, which is what we were all promised from the start. I have always felt Shaun Johnson's ego is getting in the way of his advancement. I feel he could look at Benji's career as a roadmap on how to achieve the top. Benji has always been a flighty player who only got involved at his whim, but when he decides to be involved throughout the game, he is phenominal. Johnson could save himself 3 or 4 years by taking that attitude now.

My mate feels this ineffective long bomb down the throat of the FB from 40 mts out is clearly a team game plan, while I feel it is proof that Shaun Johnson is not ready to break away from a team game plan and make these calls by himself. If we didn't factor in his coach/halfback statement and the stories that came out of the crisis meeting about the team not liking Elliott's game plan, then I could accept that argument, but with these faactored in it shows me he is too immature to be the superstar he is destined to eventually be.

I also take the fact that Iro benched Johnson immediately after Bluey was overthrown as a part of my opinion his attitude is dangerous.

We could still potentially limp into a finals series using the skills he is currently showing occassionally, but if he stood back from his ego and had a look at the scheme, we could soar to a Premiership.

I believe some thrive under a big ego, while others wilt. I have always thought that Locke was a thriver. He is incredible when he is feeling good, but throw some negativity in, and he disappears. That is why I feel that the Tomkins issue hanging over his head for the past 6 months has produced the near invisible Kevin Locke. If he is a starter in the team somewhere next year (especially if we have an Auckland Nines title in the cabinet) he will be back. I feel that Johnson's ego will always keep him from reaching the top. He has appeared sulky at times (when Iro refused to select him, and when Elliott benched him). Get over that, and get over the line to our first title.

 

[Inruin]

IMO having Dean Bell and Ruben Wiki in fulltime roles with the club is a great thing. Two of the most professional, successful and respected past players we have had. If that doesnt help the team nothing will. I would suggets that the 2012 season bought a number of things to a head, and the 2013 season reinforced alot of it. Elliot gave them the season with a lot of faith and consistant selection. Changes would have been difficult during the season and now its over the line in the sand has been drawn. The club management seems to be all on the same page at last, shape up or.......dare i say it.........abandon the ship mentioned already. Yes we may lose some players but the production line will continue, we will sign other players that want the opportunity, that will put in the effort on and off the field. The vast majority of our team are good, hard working, skilled players. Unfortunately there is a minority that bring the club down. Not anymore. LIne.....crossed......see ya.

Love the do whats best for me and my family lines too.....I read that as been called out on my effort and attitude and now have to look elsewhere.

 

[Sup42]

A lots been said
The more you think about it the simpler it is
Being Locked into a local development philosophy was taken beyond the limits of it's benefits

Everything in moderation.

Worst Warriors team in history = get rid of that team

Simple

Rebuild with better imports and the remnants of the old team that are consistent performers / try hard every week.

Just keep shopping the market till the head has been cut off this monster.

 

[blcu2003]

My fav scarface quotes:
"Orders? You giving me orders? Amigo, the only thing in this world that gives orders is balls. Balls. You got that?"

"All I’ve got in this world is my balls and my word and I don’t break them for no one. You understand???"

my fav scarface quote:

" you gotta make the money first. When you get the money, you get the power. Then when you get the power, you get the women."

"say hello to my bazooka!"

 

[edd]

A lots been said
The more you think about it the simpler it is
Being Locked into a local development philosophy was taken beyond the limits of it's benefits

Everything in moderation.

Worst Warriors team in history = get rid of that team

Simple

Rebuild with better imports and the remnants of the old team that are consistent performers / try hard every week.

Just keep shopping the market till the head has been cut off this monster.

I think we were locked into the idea of a local development system, but that's all it was, an idea. Instead of development our juniors have been told to throw the ball around and hope for the best. And, unfortunately for our first grade team, it's worked.

This has fostered the attitude of 'the team who scores the most points wins', (as opposed to 'the team who concedes the least points wins'), and of course lazy defending became the norm, as players put all their focus on attack. Which explains why we lose to bottom of the table teams who are strong defenders... ala the Dragons.

 

[blcu2003]

My two cents - if you want to change a culture, then it needs to start at the very top.

No point trying to clean out players when there's no talent available to replace them with.

To me, the players are being used as escape goats for the likes of Wayne Scurrah & his cronies.

so easy to blame the players.

if a company fails - the first to go are usually those incharge of running the company - not the workers.

 

[slaughterhouse.sa]

A lots been said
The more you think about it the simpler it is
Being Locked into a local development philosophy was taken beyond the limits of it's benefits

Everything in moderation.

Worst Warriors team in history = get rid of that team

Simple

Rebuild with better imports and the remnants of the old team that are consistent performers / try hard every week.

Just keep shopping the market till the head has been cut off this monster.

I think you have misread the situation.

Elliot and all senior management arent dumb.
They know the future of the Warriors and any potential will be on teh success of their local development.

This development has been ideal - they have said they have and will continue to place focus on this side of things.
Hence they have identified this as a focus and improving it.

Hence Ackland gonners.

Improve the development and these young players will be more NRL ready.

Lowrie & Neilsen - will be replaced by Bhana & Laumape/Solomone Kata etc before 2015.
They are to fill immeadiate needs.

Even Tomkins will eventually get replaced by a Warriors Junior.[DOUBLEPOST=1380422821][/DOUBLEPOST]

My two cents - if you want to change a culture, then it needs to start at the very top.

No point trying to clean out players when there's no talent available to replace them with.

To me, the players are being used as escape goats for the likes of Wayne Scurrah & his cronies.

so easy to blame the players.

if a company fails - the first to go are usually those incharge of running the company - not the workers.

They are only 'cleaning' out a handful of players. Taukieaho, Mara and maybe Packer potentially Locke.
No players to replace them - Raymond Faitala mariner has already replaced Taukieaho.
Mara replaced by Havili and perhaps Vete to replace packer.

Young, potentially better and already a better attitude.

 

[Miket12]

Just heard Knobby's lost over 70% of his tweeter followers - Sommerset Retirement Villages have restricted the accounts of all their residents.

 

[Gizzyfan]

I have seen one news article saying the Warriors have given Locke 2 weeks to sort his future. Has this been confirmed by anyone close to the club. It just doesn't sound right to me.

The other thing about players leaving is that IMO there are 3 reasons why they will be going, Attitude, not seen as value for the future, and not agreeing with course club is taking. Broadly speaking Mara comes under attitude, disagreeing with the Coach about how he should be played is just dumb and would piss off any Coach. Tukieaho has too many players ahead of him at Centre and 2nd Row, difficult to justify his Cap space, others will be in this category. Packer seems to disagree with Club plans, wants to move on. It is a shame as he has done the Warriors proud, I for one hopes it works out for him.

Players have to realise their value on the market is affected by how that team performs. It should be a matter of pride to do their best to make team successful week after week. I want to see the senior players start kicking arse, they have appointed a Leadership group, start leading. It is a lot easier for senior players to set the standard than Coaches, for me that is an expected role of a player in a Leadership group, to show the young guys the way and keep them on it It also makes the senior players more accountable on and off the field.

The best analogy going is that a team plays how it trains. If our senior players can set the benchmark for training and off field behaviours and dress in team situations. These leaders don't have to be starters, I see a big role for people like Godinet in this respect. I want the players pressured to execute their roles under the duress of fatigue. At the end of the day it is not about photo opportunities and hair product, it is about winning.

Here endeth the lesson.

 

[edd]

Just heard Knobby's lost over 70% of his tweeter followers - Sommerset Retirement Villages have restricted the accounts of all their residents.

I don't know this story. Would you mind filling me in?