General Club Culture At The Warriors - Is There A Problem?

[Akkerz]

I think you are way off with a few of those names.

I have had a sneaking suspicion that Mateo is a shit stirrer for a while now. I mentioned quite some time ago (before Inu left) that I thought he might be a trouble maker. Inu had been dumped by a few coaches, and had spent his whole career alongside Mateo, who has had his own issues with Twitter and attitudes toward his critics. Inu left, and his problems seemed to clear up. The same issues now appear to be ingrained in a wide group. Is he the cause?

Reckon you could be right about Mateo. imo he's not an asset to the team due to attitude etc and although I don't think he is the sole shit stirrer , he's definately on my list of senior player suspects. Looking back to 2011/ 2012 when this disrespect showed it's ugly head, it's not difficult to figure out who is still there while the attitude persists. I'm including Wiki in the group too as I have doubts about his motives. Just my personal opinion. Feel free to disagree.

 

[¿N. ig-mah¿]

Reckon you could be right about Mateo. imo he's not an asset to the team due to attitude etc and although I don't think he is the sole shit stirrer , he's definately on my list of senior player suspects. Looking back to 2011/ 2012 when this disrespect showed it's ugly head, it's not difficult to figure out who is still there while the attitude persists. I'm including Wiki in the group too as I have doubts about his motives. Just my personal opinion. Feel free to disagree.

I have not been keen on Wiki's input in the team for a couple of years. He has been heavily involved as a trainer in the last 2 campaigns. Last year, he wanted the job only part time, as he was concentrating on his business, but this year is full time. I dislike his Kava ceremony obsession (I have heard the U20s are now having Kava ceremonies). I feel it is no coincidence that since they have taken to drinking Kava that the attitude problems have appeared. I don't feel he has offered anything effective to the club as a trainer. Sure he is a tough trainer and the guys dread his regime, but it is not stopping the problems, and it is not proving to improve defence.

 

[edd]

Wiki's nick name is KavaKing?

I'm not sure anyone with a recreational, psychoactive substance for a nick name should be an integral part of our club...

Imagine a head trainer nicknamed 'Drunken Master', or 'Barron von Ganja' and you get my point....

Don't get me wrong, I've tried Kava and liked it. But it's definitely in the same category as alcohol... and it definitely causes liver damage (and turns you face yellow) if you drink loads of it.

Maybe the boys are getting high on the Kava when they should be going into Buddhist like trances states before the games? Ha Ha...

 

[Blain]

I think you are way off with a few of those names.

You list Locke based on Tweets and rumour. When was the last bad Tweet from him? It was the Tweet about being bummed that Iro didn't get the coaching job (as far as I am aware), which in my opinion was not bad or offensive at all, but simply voicing his disappointment for his preferred option. It gave no reflection on Matt Elliott or his ability to coach. The rumours are wild and unfounded right now. ME stated months back, when the Tomkins talk happened, that he had big plans for Locke in the future. It was also rumoured that he told Locke to make a play for the 5/8th jersey if he wanted it. All of the talk about him leaving is pure speculation from media who cannot think outside the box. Perhaps the club intend on using Tomkins in the halves, or Locke, or even shift Locke to the wing, as many have suggested. As far as I know there has been nothing from Locke apart from a Tweet a few weeks back saying he wasn't going anywhere and loved being at the club. Dean Bell, and I think Elliott have both responded to questions saying Locke is wanted, but if he feels he needs to move on, they will allow it. In isolation, that could sound like they are prepared to ditch him, but if the reporters are expressly asking about Locke's future (as I expect is the case), then that answer is the only answer they could give.

Godinet is another that seems a little out of left field to me. He has never shown to be a part of this bad clique that has appeared. He has actually been labelled as nothing but dedicated, from what I have heard. Even with depth, I would imagine the club would be keen to retain him, at the very least, as a good leader for the Vulcans, and a good role model for the younger ones moving up to NSW Cup from U20s.

Carlos, perhaps, but I doubt it. There is no talk of attitude with him, and ME has pointed him out as a future star. I don't think you would go from that to dumping the guy based on a limited number of appearances in a foreign position. I would imagine the first thing ME would do was trial him in other positions at NSW Cup level.

Ikahihifo is one I feel strongly won't be in that group. He may not be a first choice player, but if Packer is gone (as is expected by most), Matulino is making sounds like he is unhappy at the moment, and Gubb is just digging hole after hole to bury his career, then I believe that Seb would be crucial depth for the front row.

I believe the group is made up of

Packer
Sam Lousi
Sione Lousi
Gubb
Taukeiaho
and possibly Mateo (though it could be Matulino).

I have had a sneaking suspicion that Mateo is a shit stirrer for a while now. I mentioned quite some time ago (before Inu left) that I thought he might be a trouble maker. Inu had been dumped by a few coaches, and had spent his whole career alongside Mateo, who has had his own issues with Twitter and attitudes toward his critics. Inu left, and his problems seemed to clear up. The same issues now appear to be ingrained in a wide group. Is he the cause?

You need to read my post fully. I agree with what you've said, I never mentioned Locke being a tweeter, I said rumoured to be leaving and I would hope that he stays. The other 3 were purely stabs in the dark, based on our current roster, as I said.

BTW Wiki is not the head fitness trainer at the Warriors, he is strength and conditioning coach. Carl Jennings is the main man if you want to point fingers at fitness this year (which has probably been one of our best injury wise in years). Wiki is the senior staff that actually has everyones respect, which is apparently hard to come by these days. Kava sessions? It's a just bonding thing in my mind.

 

[¿N. ig-mah¿]

You need to read my post fully. I agree with what you've said, I never mentioned Locke being a tweeter, I said rumoured to be leaving and I would hope that he stays. The other 3 were purely stabs in the dark, based on our current roster, as I said.

BTW Wiki is not the head fitness trainer at the Warriors, he is strength and conditioning coach. Carl Jennings is the main man if you want to point fingers at fitness this year (which has probably been one of our best injury wise in years). Wiki is the senior staff that actually has everyones respect, which is apparently hard to come by these days. Kava sessions? It's a just bonding thing in my mind.

I wasn't accusing you of saying Locke was involved in the Tweeting. Just that he seems to be getting lumped in with the Tweeters and some have mentioned Twitter as one of his problems (which is just a regurgatation of unfounded rumours). And the other players mentioned, I was simply giving my reasons why I didn't beleive they were involved.

I'm not blaming team fitness as part of our problem. I am specifically blaming Wiki as part of it. It isn't his training techniques that are the issue, but the imbibing in Kava that I take as the issue. It may be great for comraddery and keeps the guys out of trouble, as they are not out in public drinking, but maybe it is creating too much bonding and brotherhood. It appears too many of the boys have each others backs against anyone and everyone. They even seem to be standing up together against the "establishment". This may be why they "respect" Reuben, which makes him more like the likeable drug dealer, rather than anyone who deserves respect. Anyone getting the widespread respect of the players would surely have knocked the player revolt on the head early in the piece, rather than allowing it to continue building for 2 years, if they were in it for the team.

 

[Buck777]

I have not been keen on Wiki's input in the team for a couple of years. He has been heavily involved as a trainer in the last 2 campaigns. Last year, he wanted the job only part time, as he was concentrating on his business, but this year is full time. I dislike his Kava ceremony obsession (I have heard the U20s are now having Kava ceremonies). I feel it is no coincidence that since they have taken to drinking Kava that the attitude problems have appeared. I don't feel he has offered anything effective to the club as a trainer. Sure he is a tough trainer and the guys dread his regime, but it is not stopping the problems, and it is not proving to improve defence.

I can't speak for this year with Wiki's involvement, but I do know a bit about 2012. Basically the warriors had him on the books as a trainer but didn't pay him. He had to go outside of the warriors to make a living as a physical trainer, so was able to put less and less time into his undefined role as the warriors trainer. It was a complete mess. I heard stories about wiki showing up and having an hour a week with the boys. Thought that wasn't too flash until it was said that it was almost a voluntary appearance on ruebans behalf. Just another disaster story from 2012. The thing is that Wiki ticks a few boxes. One, he's fit and his mantra is no pain no gain. Two, he's been to the top in the NRL, so respect has been earnt. Three, he's Polynesian. He knows how the boys think.But, he doesn't suffer culture excuses.Four, he's humble. Remember when Cleary dropped him to the vulcans because he was playing average? He didn't tweet his frustration, or moan, just played himself back into the top team. Plus he's a good family man...not that that would impress some of the warriors.
When I look at the drug/sport enhancing sagas bringing the game into disrepute I wonder just how bad kava is. Locke and co can't handle their piss, stories abound of their idiotic antics around town. Maybe someone like him would do well under Wiki.
Wiki has done a lot behind the scenes this year, especially with guys like Hurrell. I personally welcome him into the warriors camp. Having an ethos of being super fit must have a positive rub off effect.

 

[Rizzah]

I don't know how anyone can question Wiki's dedication to the team. He's an NRL legend. He was a pivital part of the raiders for over 10years, in arguably the best team of the 90's. you don't play 225 games for 1 team by being a disruptive figure.
Wiki's in peak physical condition which takes hard work and complete dedication. esp with his advancing years. If the kids in our team had his dedication to training they wouldn't have time to be on twitter or acting the fool.

I think the biggest problem with this team is lack of experienced leadership within the actual playing group. Also the current crop of Mannering, Friend, TL, Ropati seem to me to be too nice (i could be very wrong). We lack a Steve Price, Kevin Campion, Micheal Luck type figure in the group that will give the boys a spray when they aren't pulling their weight both on the field and off.

 

[¿N. ig-mah¿]

I don't know how anyone can question Wiki's dedication to the team. He's an NRL legend. is in peak physical condition which takes hard work and complete dedication. esp with his advancing years. If the kids in our team had his dedication to training they wouldn't have time to be on twitter or acting the fool.
I think the biggest problem with this team is lack of experienced leadership within the actual playing group. Also the current crop of Mannering, Friend, TL, Ropati seem to me to be too nice (i could be very wrong). We lack a Steve Price, Kevin Campion, Micheal Luck type figure in the group that will give the boys a spray when they aren't pulling their weight both on the field and off.

I am not doubting Wiki's dedication. I am in no way implying he is not putting in the effort, or that he is sabotaging anything. I just think some of his principles are wrong for this particular team, at this particular time.

I don't know if it is fair to use your Twitter analogy for Wiki. Perhaps if he had it available to him, he may have used it. We have no idea how many previous players would have made fools of themselves if social media had been so prevalent in their day.

I agree with your point about the playing group, but I still feel Wiki could be playing a bit part (inadvertantly) in our problems.

 

[Rizzah]

To me the guy is a model professional. Family man. help/is present in the community.
We could do with a few more people like this around the club in my mind.
You don't get to where he is by being a selfish, egotistical individual, which is what i think a lot of our young players suffer from.
What principles of his do you think are wrong?

The eroding of the experienced leaders is the root of our problems. not wiki.
[DOUBLEPOST=1380347974][/DOUBLEPOST]The shit thing about this apparent clean out, that may or may not happen, is that we may end up with another rebuilding year.. which is a depressing thought.

 

[¿N. ig-mah¿]

I can't speak for this year with Wiki's involvement, but I do know a bit about 2012. Basically the warriors had him on the books as a trainer but didn't pay him. He had to go outside of the warriors to make a living as a physical trainer, so was able to put less and less time into his undefined role as the warriors trainer. It was a complete mess. I heard stories about wiki showing up and having an hour a week with the boys. Thought that wasn't too flash until it was said that it was almost a voluntary appearance on ruebans behalf. Just another disaster story from 2012. The thing is that Wiki ticks a few boxes. One, he's fit and his mantra is no pain no gain. Two, he's been to the top in the NRL, so respect has been earnt. Three, he's Polynesian. He knows how the boys think.But, he doesn't suffer culture excuses.Four, he's humble. Remember when Cleary dropped him to the vulcans because he was playing average? He didn't tweet his frustration, or moan, just played himself back into the top team. Plus he's a good family man...not that that would impress some of the warriors.
When I look at the drug/sport enhancing sagas bringing the game into disrepute I wonder just how bad kava is. Locke and co can't handle their piss, stories abound of their idiotic antics around town. Maybe someone like him would do well under Wiki.
Wiki has done a lot behind the scenes this year, especially with guys like Hurrell. I personally welcome him into the warriors camp. Having an ethos of being super fit must have a positive rub off effect.

I remember hearing or reading at the start of 2012 that Wiki had taken a role at the club (to do with strength and conditioning or somesuch) but that it would only be on a part time basis, as him and his wife were putting in a more concerted effort to build their personal training business up. I'm sure that she had been doing it solo for a while and that he was going to get more involved. At the time, I wondered if it was a good idea to have someone part time. As I have just said, I am not doubting his intentions, just wondering aloud if his input has been what the players need. My strong opinion is that though Kava is legal and considered non-harmful, it is just another drug/alcohol substitute, albeit with different affects than the other choices.

I have a strong belief that the club needs to take a strong stance on alcohol. Locke in particular has a serious problem, and seems to be cruising along unnoticed by the club. I have close friends who have seen him in a compromising position due to his inability to say when (this was in the pre-season, so perhaps the club allows it then but no during the season?). I believe the club should take a zero alcohol stance with him, and anyone else who needs it. But I don't think that private Kava ceremonies are fixing this issue, but simply disguising it as something else. I am not 100%, but I am pretty sure that I have seen someone post a Locke Tweet that mentioned Kava, and I don't think it was that long ago. If I am remembering correctly, then partaking in Kava has done nothing to help him thusfar.

Wiki's level of fitness should be a good thing, but the players have been surrounded by players with this same philosophy in Benry Henry, Elijah Taylor and Nathan Friend, and perhaps others. It hasn't changed the players aaround them at all, from what I can see. Superfit doesn't neccessarily improve performance or attitude in everyone.

You may have hit on another angle that I have thought about at times. Many people talk of how certain people are good at dealing with Polynesian players because they know how they think, and how to talk to them. Could this be another issue? Perhaps one difference that the Polynesian players at the Warriors and at other clubs have that separates them is that other clubs do nothing different for these guys, while the Warriors are inadvertantly creating a sense of deserving special treatment. I am well aware of the differences in the upbringing and behaviour toward others from Polynesian people compared to other cultures, but should a professional organisation adapt their techniques specifically for these players, or would they do better to make no provisions for anyone?

Please everyone, don't take this as a racial discussion, but simply a musing over whether this could be involved in, or in part causing the clubs issues.

 

[¿N. ig-mah¿]

To me the guy is a model professional. Family man. help/is present in the community.
We could do with a few more people like this around the club in my mind.
You don't get to where he is by being a selfish, egotistical individual, which is what i think a lot of our young players suffer from.
What principles of his do you think are wrong?

The eroding of the experienced leaders is the root of our problems. not wiki.
[DOUBLEPOST=1380347974][/DOUBLEPOST]The shit thing about this apparent clean out, that may or may not happen, is that we may end up with another rebuilding year.. which is a depressing thought.

You're misinterpreting me. I have not said his principles are wrong (or if I have, its not what I meant). I believe he is humble, non-egocentric and a hard worker, but I have just said that he may not be having the effect that we would hope for. The number one thing I question is Kava. I heard him a few years back speaking about his ceremonies and what he thought it did for the team (it was when it was on the news about him having to go to great lengths to get it into England for a 4 Nations). At the time, I understood what he was saying but wasn't convinced it was the right idea. When I found out it had begun at the Warriors after he took on a role at the club, I was concerned. If I remember right, then the players are having their ceremonies at his mother's house. Is this creating a friendship when a more hands-off and professional relationship would be better? I have no idea if my concerns were right, but it is one angle to look at it from.

As you say, we could use more like him at the club, but having the attributes you have listed doesn't always mean you will cause a positive result.

I totally accept the issue of lack of senior/experienced players, but that is not going to help the team. It just means exactly what you have said - that we will have to rebuild, again.

 

[slaughterhouse.sa]

I honestly think this thread should be closed down.
The amount of dribble and x files - mumbo jumbo is hilarious.
Reminds of One tribe forum.

Clearly Warriors staff have worked hard to instill a hard working . focused approach for players.
We have all seen improvement in individuals and players as a whole throughout the season.

Obviously end of season - they have identified individuals they dont think are skilled enough or fit their requirements.
Or more importantly they dont have the right attitude, or they are resistance to change and potentially (re: Packer) affecting the vibe of the rest of the group.

People bagging out Ben Matulino - I imagine Packer + Locke are two of his best mates.
Guys he spends everyday with since 2008. (exag).
Judging by twitter - they all have kids etc now making it even more emotional.

Clearly Matulino would be upset - even if their were rumours of them leaving.

However he is still clearly a Senior player and somebody who will be here for a long time imo.

Let the off-season happen and improvements happen and then make judgements.[DOUBLEPOST=1380351315][/DOUBLEPOST]

You're misinterpreting me. I have not said his principles are wrong (or if I have, its not what I meant). I believe he is humble, non-egocentric and a hard worker, but I have just said that he may not be having the effect that we would hope for. The number one thing I question is Kava. I heard him a few years back speaking about his ceremonies and what he thought it did for the team (it was when it was on the news about him having to go to great lengths to get it into England for a 4 Nations). At the time, I understood what he was saying but wasn't convinced it was the right idea. When I found out it had begun at the Warriors after he took on a role at the club, I was concerned. If I remember right, then the players are having their ceremonies at his mother's house. Is this creating a friendship when a more hands-off and professional relationship would be better? I have no idea if my concerns were right, but it is one angle to look at it from.

As you say, we could use more like him at the club, but having the attributes you have listed doesn't always mean you will cause a positive result.

I totally accept the issue of lack of senior/experienced players, but that is not going to help the team. It just means exactly what you have said - that we will have to rebuild, again.

go back into hibernation....too much theories not enough reality

 

[¿N. ig-mah¿]

I honestly think this thread should be closed down.
The amount of dribble and x files - mumbo jumbo is hilarious.
Reminds of One tribe forum.

Clearly Warriors staff have worked hard to instill a hard working . focused approach for players.
We have all seen improvement in individuals and players as a whole throughout the season.

Obviously end of season - they have identified individuals they dont think are skilled enough or fit their requirements.
Or more importantly they dont have the right attitude, or they are resistance to change and potentially (re: Packer) affecting the vibe of the rest of the group.

People bagging out Ben Matulino - I imagine Packer + Locke are two of his best mates.
Guys he spends everyday with since 2008. (exag).
Judging by twitter - they all have kids etc now making it even more emotional.

Clearly Matulino would be upset - even if their were rumours of them leaving.

However he is still clearly a Senior player and somebody who will be here for a long time imo.

Let the off-season happen and improvements happen and then make judgements.[DOUBLEPOST=1380351315][/DOUBLEPOST]

go back into hibernation....too much theories not enough reality

Your theory, also, is nothing more than theory.

I'm sure many would have scoffed a few months ago if talk of a pseudo-gang culture amongst so-called professional athletes was causing issues, but it is apparent that could very well be the case. There appears to be some amount of truth to the Packer rumours. Matulino did make a comment on Twitter with incredibly bad timing, and Locke does have the potential of shifting clubs, due to the threat to his position. Of course there will be speculation.

The Reuben Wiki comments have been between me and Akkerz with a few others chiming in. If you don't like what we are saying, voice an opinion, or stay out, rather than demanding it be shut down.

I'm not sure why you feel this thread should shut down, simply because you don't enjoy it. Many others have been involved in it. Perhaps if you don't like the way the thread is going you could avoid clicking on it, rather than expecting it to shut down.

And I must have missed the rule requiring all topics to remain in reality. Specultation is the driving force of this forum.

 

[edd]

You may have hit on another angle that I have thought about at times. Many people talk of how certain people are good at dealing with Polynesian players because they know how they think, and how to talk to them. Could this be another issue? Perhaps one difference that the Polynesian players at the Warriors and at other clubs have that separates them is that other clubs do nothing different for these guys, while the Warriors are inadvertantly creating a sense of deserving special treatment. I am well aware of the differences in the upbringing and behaviour toward others from Polynesian people compared to other cultures, but should a professional organisation adapt their techniques specifically for these players, or would they do better to make no provisions for anyone?

Please everyone, don't take this as a racial discussion, but simply a musing over whether this could be involved in, or in part causing the clubs issues.

I think the converse is more racial personally...

Steve Matai doesn't need a helping hand over at manly. And I don't think anyone would suggest SBW could do with some Polynesian mentors at the Roosters.. They, and all the other Poly boys, at every other league club in the world, stand upright all by themselves...

Is it a babysitting mentality that's causing us all these problems?

 

[slaughterhouse.sa]

I am not doubting Wiki's dedication. I am in no way implying he is not putting in the effort, or that he is sabotaging anything. I just think some of his principles are wrong for this particular team, at this particular time.

I don't know if it is fair to use your Twitter analogy for Wiki. Perhaps if he had it available to him, he may have used it. We have no idea how many previous players would have made fools of themselves if social media had been so prevalent in their day.

I agree with your point about the playing group, but I still feel Wiki could be playing a bit part (inadvertantly) in our problems.

Please I find it a disgrace ...your having a go at Wiki.
For mine he is with no comparison....as a player on and off the field.

That aside .....Kava.
Only tried it once however I fully endorse the idea and philosphies of Kava.
as opposed to the alternative of getting on the piss together.

Yes ...it taste average...but so does rum and most spirits.

Before you have a go at....try it

 

[slaughterhouse.sa]

Your theory, also, is nothing more than theory.

I'm sure many would have scoffed a few months ago if talk of a pseudo-gang culture amongst so-called professional athletes was causing issues, but it is apparent that could very well be the case. There appears to be some amount of truth to the Packer rumours. Matulino did make a comment on Twitter with incredibly bad timing, and Locke does have the potential of shifting clubs, due to the threat to his position. Of course there will be speculation.

The Reuben Wiki comments have been between me and Akkerz with a few others chiming in. If you don't like what we are saying, voice an opinion, or stay out, rather than demanding it be shut down.

I'm not sure why you feel this thread should shut down, simply because you don't enjoy it. Many others have been involved in it. Perhaps if you don't like the way the thread is going you could avoid clicking on it, rather than expecting it to shut down.

And I must have missed the rule requiring all topics to remain in reality. Specultation is the driving force of this forum.

Why should it be shut down....because it is spiralling out of control with dribble....some people specialities
Just like those said players behaviour was on twitter.

You are so far away from the whole situation its sad.... there is no pseudo-gang culture.
It players being idiots ...and isnt connected to the ACTUAL ISSUE.

the actual issue...players not having the correct attitude....resisting Coaching iniatives etc.

The Twitter issue is only a reflection of that issue. Not the biggest issue like everybody is making out.

Forget pre-season training and pushing the boys mentals limits.

Send the boys to a summer school - Communication paper at university.
Specialising in Social Media. LMAO.

Remember fellow Keyboard Warriors....it still is about football at the end of the day

Packer is probably going....Locke possibly.

Whilst Matulinos comments would of being directly related to his best mates leaving.
However Matulino can suck it up after dissapointment..and keep on going.

Can the FANS?????

Taukieaho + Packer = leaving. Like I said they would of been released because Staff dont require them.
Whether it be on depth/talent or attitude based. Not a theory..a reality

 

[¿N. ig-mah¿]

Please I find it a disgrace ...your having a go at Wiki.
For mine he is with no comparison....as a player on and off the field.

That aside .....Kava.
Only tried it once however I fully endorse the idea and philosphies of Kava.
as opposed to the alternative of getting on the piss together.

Yes ...it taste average...but so does rum and most spirits.

Before you have a go at....try it

I am not endorsing alcohol over Kava. Quite the opposite. I can understand the thought process behind the preference for Kava. It keeps the guys out of the public eye, its ceremonies promote a feeling of team and family, and it is (supposedly, as you point out, I have not tried it, but know others who have) supposed to be a much more sociable, and passive high than alcohol or other alternatives.

My preference would be a tea-totalling season, with the off-season as the time to live it up. I realise that young guys of the age of the players will want to cut loose from time to time, but as professionals, I can't see a problem with a club policy against alcohol.

I have simply said, in my opinion, it could be involved in this player power issue that appears to be making a resurgence.

 

[edd]

Why should it be shut down....because it is spiralling out of control with dribble....some people specialities
Just like those said players behaviour was on twitter.

You are so far away from the whole situation its sad.... there is no pseudo-gang culture.
It players being idiots ...and isnt connected to the ACTUAL ISSUE.

the actual issue...players not having the correct attitude....resisting Coaching iniatives etc.

The Twitter issue is only a reflection of that issue. Not the biggest issue like everybody is making out.

Forget pre-season training and pushing the boys mentals limits.

Send the boys to a summer school - Communication paper at university.
Specialising in Social Media. LMAO.

Remember fellow Keyboard Warriors....it still is about football at the end of the day

Packer is clearly going....Locke possibly.

Whilst Matulinos comments would of being directly related to his best mates leaving.
However Matulino can suck it up after dissapointment..and keep on going.

Can the FANS?????

Taukieaho + Packer = leaving. Like I said they would of been released because Staff dont require them.
Whether it be on depth/talent or attitude based. Not a theory..a reality

We know for sure Taukieaho is leaving us. But is Packer going or is that still speculation/rumor/Chinese whisper at this stage?

 

[slaughterhouse.sa]

I am not endorsing alcohol over Kava. Quite the opposite. I can understand the thought process behind the preference for Kava. It keeps the guys out of the public eye, its ceremonies promote a feeling of team and family, and it is (supposedly, as you point out, I have not tried it, but know others who have) supposed to be a much more sociable, and passive high than alcohol or other alternatives.

My preference would be a tea-totalling season, with the off-season as the time to live it up. I realise that young guys of the age of the players will want to cut loose from time to time, but as professionals, I can't see a problem with a club policy against alcohol.

I have simply said, in my opinion, it could be involved in this player power issue that appears to be making a resurgence.

Once again....Nigmah...reality.
Professional what...Monks.

Once again there is no apparent issue with alcohol.

Who said it is a player power issue?
I see plenty of Power with the coaching staff/mgmt - if they are releasing blokes still under contract.

 

[edd]

Please I find it a disgrace ...your having a go at Wiki.
For mine he is with no comparison....as a player on and off the field.

That aside .....Kava.
Only tried it once however I fully endorse the idea and philosphies of Kava.
as opposed to the alternative of getting on the piss together.

Yes ...it taste average...but so does rum and most spirits.

Before you have a go at....try it

Kava side effects:

Causality indicated: scaly skin rash, weight loss, raised Gamma Glutamyl Transpeptidase liver enzyme levels, nausea, loss of appetite or indigestion; Association indicated but causality unclear: red sore eyes, impotence or loss of sexual drive, self-reported poor health, raised cholesterol, and loss of time and money, low motivation and 'slow/lazy' days following use, reduced alcohol consumption and related violence; Association hypothesised: fits or seizures, Melioidosis, Ischaemic Heart Disease, protective effects for cancer; No association indicated: cognitive performance; No association suggested: cognitive impairment, liver toxicity or permanent liver damage, other pneumonia; No association hypothesised: hallucinations.

I'm not saying it's worse than alcohol, or anything else. But it's definitely not a high performance supplement IMO...