Charnze Nicoll-Klokstad

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Jordan G

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I agree ...looks quite good when the tackles are weak or non-existent but looks less effective than Fus or Ken when up against some proper tackling.Our forwards aren't going well enough at the moment to give us enough go forward...for that reason CNK will have to wait a while longer yet particularly if Manu returns.
Really don't like this go forward argument.

Nothing is more ridiculous to me than saying we can't pick a winger/centre because forwards.

Did people miss the last two weeks where the Raiders and Storm back three got them on the front foot through speed and agility?

Are we really getting that much momentum off the back of Maumalo when it's so obvious when he's getting the ball that they line up 3 guys to tackle him?

This is such Warriors thinking. Run straight, run hard, hope to run them over. How about some speed, agility, footy smarts for once.

It's like we'll only pick players who are willing to run through brick walls despite the unlocked door being a couple metres to the left of them.
 
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koolkat

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Yup totally agree, play someone with some wheels.something this club hasn't had for donkeys years.who was the last one oh yeah,lumape :arghh: and wells
 
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wazzas

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All the hype round CNK seems to be on here with the fans, not so much in the media where they give an inferior Lolohea the wraps. Playing a rather long stint in reserve grade seems to do players wonders when they hit first grade, Cody Walker's a perfect example. I don't think CNK being in reserves for this long is necessarily a bad thing, the same with Mason Lino, it gives them more time to remove weaknesses from their game without the pressure of first-grade, which seems to have a long impact on players who are introduced before they are ready.
 
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Hadyn

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Really don't like this go forward argument.

Nothing is more ridiculous to me than saying we can't pick a winger/centre because forwards.

Did people miss the last two weeks where the Raiders and Storm back three got them on the front foot through speed and agility?

Are we really getting that much momentum off the back of Maumalo when it's so obvious when he's getting the ball that they line up 3 guys to tackle him?

This is such Warriors thinking. Run straight, run hard, hope to run them over. How about some speed, agility, footy smarts for once.

It's like we'll only pick players who are willing to run through brick walls despite the unlocked door being a couple metres to the left of them.
Jordan G don't get me wrong.....I don't like the go forward argument either however our forwards are so ineffective at bending the defensive line at the moment that it seems to me that Kearney feels the need to put the big lumps at the back as a means of us at least making the advantage line running from the back as the forward pack cannot be relied upon to do their job.
Together with the fact that Kearney has obviously told the players to forget about off loading and late footwork as well as our outside backs having absolutely no ability to beat a man one on one with speed and skill,that we don't ever seem to contest high balls it seems to me that Kearneys plan of attack relies totally on hopefully somehow getting field position and then relying on some sort of Foran,Johnson,RTS double round play and unfortunately at the moment that is it.
With this set of outside backs gone are the days when the Warriors could score three tries in the last 10 minutes to steal a great and late comeback victory.It just won't happen and the sad thing for me is that when you are watching these games with this current mob you just know in your bones that it can't and is never a chance of happening.
We don't have it in us anymore.
 
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Jordan G

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I have no idea if Kearney actually believes that or not (none of us do) but if he does he has no business being a head coach when there are 15 other sides proving it wrong every week. More importantly two weeks in a row we got absolutely destroyed by the opposition back three sniping around the ruck with speed and agility. hell, our most effective back coming out of our own end was RTS when he got into dummy half and used his speed and agility to get in behind the ruck.

As a winger Maumalo doesn't add anything that can't be provided by a natural winger, and in return there are facets of his game that are way behind where a proper winger should be.

There has to be more going on here than what we know because I fail to see how with so much data and analysis we can be seeing something that the other clubs aren't, coming up short, and still thinking "Hey, this is a good idea."

What's more value, a winger making 150m a game or a winger making 120m a game, plus a line break, plus a try, plus at least average defense etc?

There simply has to be something other than "the guy makes metres" argument to justify it.
 
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Dunedin warrior

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It's about the balance of the team, against the storm I think we scored most times we were in their twenty, the difficulty was getting down their end. Field position is an issue for us and Maumolo is at this stage judged by the coaching staff to be more equipped for this part of the game than CNK. Maumolo also a couple of lapses on Leilua aside defends well.

CNK is also benefitting from not having played 1st grade from the grass is greener on the other side concept.

He is playing fullback at the moment which he is unlikely to play for us. Would prefer to see him play wing or centre at ISP level this season before giving him a crack.
 
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Jordan G

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While yes, this has spilled over into the CNK thread, my stance remains absent of CNK as well.

And how is picking Maumalo about the balance of the team when picking Maumalo is part of the reason why the team lacks balance and despite being in the team you said so yourself that we still struggled for field position and a big part of the Storm's field position was the way their back three turned our forwards around with speed and agility?

And Maumalo defending well is something I don't agree with, but will argue that a big part of his defensive lapses is that he's going up against guys who are simply too quick and agile for him to get a grasp on in a one on one situation. Funny how that happens with a forward on the wing.
 
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Dunedin warrior

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While yes, this has spilled over into the CNK thread, my stance remains absent of CNK as well.

And how is picking Maumalo about the balance of the team when picking Maumalo is part of the reason why the team lacks balance and despite being in the team you said so yourself that we still struggled for field position and a big part of the Storm's field position was the way their back three turned our forwards around with speed and agility?

And Maumalo defending well is something I don't agree with, but will argue that a big part of his defensive lapses is that he's going up against guys who are simply too quick and agile for him to get a grasp on in a one on one situation. Funny how that happens with a forward on the wing.

Our forward pack particularly the back row lack the ability to make yards but are defensively solid. This is an unbalanced forward pack. To compensate for this lack of yardage we 'balance' this by playing a big winger who can make yardage. This is at the expense of a more rounded winger. It's not a perfect solution and I would prefer an out and our winger.

But given the fact that they refuse to tinker with the back row and our wing options are a winger well passed his best and two utilities, I think Maumolo is the best option for the style Kearney wants to play.
 
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Jwoodzy02

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He has really good vision for the game I reckon
 
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hoolioh

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I will admit I haven't seen as much of CNK as maumalo or lolohea but the one thing that he seems to shit on both of them is his attitude. Looks like he puts everything into what he does witch is what I thought SK was all about. Im a believer in what the coach is trying to do with the club an realise its going to take some time but If lolohea gets picked ahead of him to me that's taking a backward step.
 
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Brox001

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What's more value, a winger making 150m a game or a winger making 120m a game, plus a line break, plus a try, plus at least average defense etc?
.
And a winger who does make a guarenteed 1-2 errors 10m from goal each week which we have had in both Maumalo and Manu.
 
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Jordan G

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Our forward pack particularly the back row lack the ability to make yards but are defensively solid. This is an unbalanced forward pack. To compensate for this lack of yardage we 'balance' this by playing a big winger who can make yardage. This is at the expense of a more rounded winger. It's not a perfect solution and I would prefer an out and our winger.

But given the fact that they refuse to tinker with the back row and our wing options are a winger well passed his best and two utilities, I think Maumolo is the best option for the style Kearney wants to play.
I've been preaching the poorly balanced forward pack for some time, but that doesn't mean I agree with this argument in regards to our wingers (I did actually used to argue this exact same point in regards to Manu but have changed my tune in recent seasons)

Maumalo averages 9 runs per carry rounded up. So does Hoffman, Afoa, Lillyman, Thompson, Fusitua, RTS, Gubb, Gavet, Vete, Ayshford, Matulino, Luke, basically everyone not named Mannering, Lolohea or Sao.

Forwards don't take tackles 1, 2, 3 so making up for the forwards is not a valid reason, especially when those forwards are on average per hit up making more metres.

The ONLy valid reason in regards to metres gained would be Kearney believing that the 9 metres Maumalo makes is more valuable than say the 7 metres another winger might make.

To me those 2m per run will never be enough to justify his selection.

What about compared to other wingers, ones who actually do what wingers do.

The Storm wingers both average over 10m a carry. Not only that but because of the way they threaten the line with speed and agility they get fast play the balls that their backs and forwards can gain momentum off. Maumalo sets up for his one out run, the opposition see it, and you can guarantee it will be three in the tackle for a slow PTB. 10m, a retreating defense line and quick PTB versus 9m a set defense and a slow PTB. Don't see the advantage.

Like I said, with the data analysis that's available there's no way that this can be the only reason, and to be fair to Kearney a large portion of the blame needs to be pointed towards recruitment/development for leaving us in a position where our wingers are a forward, a half/utility that nobody knows what to do with, a genuine winger we're trying to convert to centre and a fading polarising winger who can't seem to get on the field.

I still refuse to believe that this is the best option available to us. CNK above all else is a footballer. That's valuable in any team, but for a Warriors team devoid of footballers that's gold.
 
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eudebrito

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I still refuse to believe that this is the best option available to us. CNK above all else is a footballer. That's valuable in any team, but for a Warriors team devoid of footballers that's gold.
You should be representing him mate.

Its going to be a downer when he eventually gets a game and doesn’t play like a cross between Jason Nightingale and Jesus.
 
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Brother Faisal

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Doesn't matter who it's is maumalo or cnk. If you're play the balls are slow you need to get outta here. It's not always about bending the line. It's finding the crease that leaves you in the dominant position as the ball carrier. Give this cnk a crack and see if he can find the cracks.
 
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Jordan G

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You should be representing him mate.

Its going to be a downer when he eventually gets a game and doesn’t play like a cross between Jason Nightingale and Jesus.
Hopefully if he gets a chance he's given more than just one game to prove himself. Wouldn't want to see us Paasi him.

And I never compared him to Jesus. Sure J-Ro Mk II is big and fast with that whole walk on water and quick healing factor going in his favour, but he just doesn't have enough footy smarts for my liking. Plus there's the water to wine thing that leaves me concerned about his off field antics.
 
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Sup42

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Really don't like this go forward argument.

Nothing is more ridiculous to me than saying we can't pick a winger/centre because forwards.

Did people miss the last two weeks where the Raiders and Storm back three got them on the front foot through speed and agility?

Are we really getting that much momentum off the back of Maumalo when it's so obvious when he's getting the ball that they line up 3 guys to tackle him?

This is such Warriors thinking. Run straight, run hard, hope to run them over. How about some speed, agility, footy smarts for once.

It's like we'll only pick players who are willing to run through brick walls despite the unlocked door being a couple metres to the left of them.
Manu.

His Legacy has somewhat coloured the thinking of a generation of Warrior game plans.

The fifth prop.

Kearneys Kiwis borrowed on the same advantage.....and it works when you have Marty Tapau running after Manu.

Blame Clearly, he invented it, but he had young Sam Rapira, Packer, Lillyman all lining up to run off Manu.

It could still work if the Warriors found realistic fg emerging prop rotations which add a Sipley/Satay to the deal.

Unfortunately there are question marks over Ken and the ISP props....and even the great man the Beast might not have it anymore.

Sticking to a model is all well and good, but when that model is reliant on the most effective Giant Wing in NRL history + a cast of minion Props....?

You might want to review the model and ask whether it only works.....if running through brick walls....is only feasible with a once in a lifetime Winger beast.
 
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mt.wellington

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Been a huge fan of CNK. It amazes me that he hasn't debuted yet. Everytime I see him play he is usually one of the standout performers. He doesn't shirk from the upfront physical contact at all. What maybe an issue is he doesn't have as much pace as someone like Ken Maumalo. But he makes up for it with his footy smarts. His ability to assess a situation in a split second and react accordingly is the best I have seen since Jerome Ropati was coming through the grades.

It will be interesting to see if he gets a shot with Kata out...
 
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The Truth

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I don't get the whole field position is the problem, so we need big wingers argument.
The field position has been the problem while we have had big wingers.

It's obvious to me that getting in behind the line helps us out more and on a roll and eventually making more meters. Look at what RTS is doing every time he gets the ball and what happens when we go 2 wide of the ruck.

This one out shit doesn't get us anywhere after 30mins.

CNK it is your time.
 
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Miket12

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Been a huge fan of CNK. It amazes me that he hasn't debuted yet. Everytime I see him play he is usually one of the standout performers. He doesn't shirk from the upfront physical contact at all. What maybe an issue is he doesn't have as much pace as someone like Ken Maumalo. But he makes up for it with his footy smarts. His ability to assess a situation in a split second and react accordingly is the best I have seen since Jerome Ropati was coming through the grades.

It will be interesting to see if he gets a shot with Kata out...
That will make ShaunJohnson7 ShaunJohnson7 very happy to know that ;)
 
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