General 2014 Warriors NYC U20 Thread

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Sup42

Sup42

We won our reserve grade minor premiership in year one then got shut down.

This is shaping up like the giant leap backwards for the game.

Seen it all before. Lets hope Jim Doyle can find some compromise for us over there.

The third option would be the Warriors juniors getting farmed out to these other set ups but being protected.

There goes our development pathway aye.
 

slaughterhouse.sa

We won our reserve grade minor premiership in year one then got shut down.

This is shaping up like the giant leap backwards for the game.

Seen it all before. Lets hope Jim Doyle can find some compromise for us over there.

The third option would be the Warriors juniors getting farmed out to these other set ups but being protected.

There goes our development pathway aye.

Well considering he would be heavily involved in any development.
Im pretty sure he was in charge of looking at what to do with NSW cup.

Its dumb - just wasting money really.

Nobody cares one bit about reserve grade - only coaches & die hard fan.
Sponsors dont care about, Journalists dont care about it, neither do the fans.

Why spend more money? On the same players.

Bigger Salary Cap and biger Squads - yes
Raise the minimum salary cap.

Having a reserve grade - they will just pay more money

What will happen?
We will get more journeymen ....getting a longer career.

The only people happy will be Players Union
 
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snake77

snake77

I know the NRL has talked about their lower tier competition structures; and a lot of the higher profile coaches and media personalities (Example Gould and Stuart) aren't in favour of it for developing their juniors. Sure they have a point in that it is too attack based but it is a breath of fresh air to watch the less structured games that more resemble what league used to be like.

You often see reports that the under 20's competition out rates Super Rugby matches in Australia. I'm in favour of a lower tier competition that involves all clubs; I doubt we will ever see a full reserve grade again.

The competition probably does have it's flaws and having this competition having a higher profile than the NSW Cup or Queensland Cup where the clubs reserves are probably isn't ideal. But any lower tier competition restructuring should be around those competitions; maybe add knockout tournaments between the NSW and Queensland Cups.

For the other clubs they go through their other age group comps and then go to the Holden Cup. For us we finally have some way to develop our youngsters and it helps with players choosing between league or union.

Probably too early to panic until more details come through but any restructuring better include the out of state teams like us and the Storm.
 
Wellington Warrior

Wellington Warrior

I guess this is the critical paragraph for the Warriors...

"But the Holden Cup will cease to exist when the current broadcast deal concludes at the end of 2017 and replaced by age-based competitions aligned with NSW and Queensland Cup teams."

So by reading this the Warriors will have a side in the NSW competition aligned to the NSWarriors side. I doubt they would want an u18 side though as that's just more added expense in travel costs! Potentially sending 4 squads of people to Aussie every second weekend!!
 
¿N. ig-mah¿

¿N. ig-mah¿

I'm a tiny bit skeptical about that article. The mention of the Sharks/Storm alliance changing through the Sharks going to the Jets misses the key point that the Storm have already announced their move from NSW Cup to having 2 feeder clubs in the Queensland Cup. I will hold out hope that this is a crock.

I guess we, in no small way, are also responsible if this happens. We have seen a lot of movement from U20s to NSW Cup early for talented players. Our U20s team would have to be the youngest around, with many 17 and 18 year olds now getting selected.
 

Danpatmac

Guest
Bringing in the draft too… just sounds like we are going back to being a feeder to everyone else
 
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eudebrito

eudebrito

|-|
Contributor
While playing in the NSW cup U20s in 2018 will have less cachet than being the curtain raiser to the main NRL game every week, can't see it being a massive issue for us, it will be a lower standard of U20 comp, but anyone over the age of 19 who is any good is already in NSW cup anyway.

The kids still get to train like a pro and fly to sydney every second weekend for a game, they might just be playing at north sydney oval more often than suncorp stadium.

Be bad for our visibility of the next generation, but that's just the fans that are affected. The only real danger is if the NRL cuts funding for travel to auckland for the NSW cup U20 teams, then we might be in the shite.
 
Wellington Warrior

Wellington Warrior

Suppose if you actually think about the U20 competition now... Anyone who is any good is already playing NSW cup. For the Warriors the U20 side is made up largely of 17 and 18 year olds already so a change to and U18 competition will mean largely nothing...
 
Lord Gnome of Howick MBE

Lord Gnome of Howick MBE

Keep the U20s and bring back full reserve grade!
 
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slaughterhouse.sa

Suppose if you actually think about the U20 competition now... Anyone who is any good is already playing NSW cup. For the Warriors the U20 side is made up largely of 17 and 18 year olds already so a change to and U18 competition will mean largely nothing...

Please.....yo are dreaming
How about the actuall attraction to play and pursue rugby league.

Anyone who is any good.....

Did you not watch the juniors...Bunty Afoa, Brady Abbey, Sam Lisone,
Were all playing juniors.

This would be going backwards
 
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Paleaaesina2the20

Paleaaesina2the20

Not sure the motivation behind the move. Cant tell me its money.
I think it has to be to do with the rookie draft they are proposing, because it doesn't make sense to have clubs running the U20s comps if there is going to be a draft.
 
Paleaaesina2the20

Paleaaesina2the20

Following the last few rounds, I just thought I would draw attention to a player who's name I don't believe I have seen mentioned much if at all in this thread. James Bell, he is a gun. He is the best genuine lock prospect I have seen in our history of the U20s comp. He has the best tackling technique of any junior warrior I have seen, and knows how to carry the ball and score a try. He is a must for retention next year into the NSW cup.
 
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ramraider78

ramraider78

Following the last few rounds, I just thought I would draw attention to a player who's name I don't believe I have seen mentioned much if at all in this thread. James Bell, he is a gun. He is the best genuine lock prospect I have seen in our history of the U20s comp. He has the best tackling technique of any junior warrior I have seen, and knows how to carry the ball and score a try. He is a must for retention next year into the NSW cup.
I've watched him the few years in the age group comp's and he always stood out for Kura against us - fitness,work rate, attitude and heart. we even tried to get him over to us during the pre season, because a few of us rated him.
 
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mt.wellington

mt.wellington

Warriors Orange Peeler
NYC | Shutting out the Sharks
Daniel Adolph
Sun 10th August, 04:15PM
1407668578785.jpg

A spectacular finish from Vodafone Junior Warriors fullback Brad Abbey for the second of his two tries against Cronulla on Sunday. Image | www.photosport.co.nz

The Vodafone Junior Warriors made it 98 points in consecutive outings when they shut out the Cronulla Sharks 40-0 in Sundays’ 22nd-round NYC match at Mount Smart Stadium.

The home side's win followed last week's 54-6 romp over Canberra and enabled it to climb a spot to seventh on the points table.

The lop-sided final score didn’t reflect the nature of the contest early on, though; indeed it was a stalemate until the half-hour mark.

In the 15th minute fullback Brad Abbey looked to have scored after he collected an acrobatic pass from Metia Lisati, who leapt up to knock back an Ata Hingano kick. However, a captain's challenge from Cronulla revealed Lisati's foot was on the touchline before leaping to tap the ball back infield resulting in the would-be try being rubbed out.

Neither side looked like scoring following this until a critical error opened the door for the home side.

Sharks centre Paul Simona’s offload went to ground, Vodafone Junior Warriors Nathaniel Roache scooped up the loose ball and raced 50 metres to score.

Prop Bunty Afoa made the slim lead a little more comfortable heading into the break with a try in the 39th minute. Afoa received the ball at close range and took it forward himself, grabbing his first NYC try. Hingano was unable to add the extras and the side took a 10-0 lead into the sheds at the break.

The home side's performance was more convincing in the second half and the points started to pile up.

Marata Niukore was the first to cross the line after play resumed, doing so by weaving his way through the Sharks' backline and leaving defenders in his wake in the 46th minute.

Five minutes later second rower James Bell followed suit, punching his way over the line from short range. Hingano added the extras to stretch the lead to 22-0.

Their next drive down the field was equally fruitful. Abbey was able to find his way onto the score sheet after having his earlier ‘try’ written off. Quick ball movement left the Sharks listless and unable to slide across. Captain Sam Lisone threw the final pass to Abbey, who darted in for the score to make it 26-0.

Abbey was in the mix once more in the 70th minute, this time providing the crucial assist to Paul Ulberg, who crashed over in the corner. Abbey drew the defence in and threw a deft pass at the last second to the Wellington-born winger.

Halfback Semisi Tyrell was next to join the list of try scorers, selling a dummy to the Cronulla defence and racing into the space he created to score between the posts.

Not surprisingly, Abbey had a hand in the game's last - and perhaps most impressive - try. The fullback was able to break the Cronulla line on his own 20 metre line and take it all the way to score, bringing up 40 points for his side.

Next week the Vodafone Junior Warriors will expect far a more formidable challenge when they travel to Newcastle to face the first-placed Knights at Hunter Stadium.

With only four rounds now remaining, each match takes on more and more significance in the chase for finals football.

Match details | Mount Smart Stadium, Auckland

Vodafone Junior Warriors 40 (Brad Abbey 2, Nathaniel Roache, Bunty Afoa, Marata Niukore, James Bell, Paul Ulberg, Semisi Tyrell tries; Ata Hingano 4 conversions).

Cronulla Sharks 0.

Halftime: 10-0 Vodafone Junior Warriors.

Referees: Phil Haines and Shane Rehm.

Vodafone Warriors: Brad Abbey; Paul Ulberg, Nathaniel Roache, Marata Niukore, Metia Lisati; Ata Hingano, Semisi Tyrell; Sam Lisone (c), Kurt Robinson, Kouma Samson; Toafofoa Sipley, Michael Ki; James Bell. Interchange: Bunty Afoa, Adam Tuimavave-Gerrard, Jazz Tevaga, Lafu Feagaiga.

https://www.warriors.co.nz/news/2014/08/10/nyc_shutting_out_the_sharks.html
 
Wellington Warrior

Wellington Warrior

Please.....yo are dreaming
How about the actuall attraction to play and pursue rugby league.

Anyone who is any good.....

Did you not watch the juniors...Bunty Afoa, Brady Abbey, Sam Lisone,
Were all playing juniors.

This would be going backwards
Didn't say it was a good idea... Merely pointing out that anyone who was any good from the 19, 20 year old bracket are already playing NSW cup and they are!! The likes of Abbey and Afoa are still 18 so would still be playing in an U18 competition... Hence no real difference.
Obviously there would be some casualties but it's manageable to a certain extent.
The idea of a draft is just plain wrong though!!
 
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mt.wellington

mt.wellington

Warriors Orange Peeler
National Youth Competition to be scrapped as league officials go back to the drawing board
Date August 9, 2014
1407580057350.jpg-620x349.jpg

False start: The National Youth Competition has failed to deliver.

The National Youth Competition is set to be scrapped as part of a massive overhaul of the pathways to NRL progression.

The under-20s competition was ushered in with much fanfare in 2008, billed as the chance to showcase the best young talent in the game.

But the Holden Cup will cease to exist when the current broadcast deal concludes at the end of 2017 and replaced by age-based competitions aligned with NSW and Queensland Cup teams.

The ARLC has conducted extensive research on the current pathways to the elite level and there is a belief the NYC isn't serving as the best possible transition from elite junior to first grader.

It's understood the new state-based competitions would feature under-18s and under-20s age groups, which would then feed talent through to the current open-age NSW and Queensland Cup competitions.

The plan is for the champion team from each state to play off on grand final day, as will be the case when the VB Cup and Intrust Super Cup winners will for the first time in October.

"That is certainly something we'll look at as part of the next broadcast rights agreement," an NRL spokesperson said.

One of the problems plaguing the current NYC tournament is the exorbitant running costs.

This round alone, six U20s teams – the Bulldogs, Tigers, Roosters, Eels, Raiders and Storm – will travel interstate, while the Sharks head across the Tasman to take on the Warriors.

The travel and accommodation costs are a huge impost to clubs, many which are already struggling financially. Under the new system, there will be huge savings almost all games will be played along state lines.

The overhaul will also address concerns that many talented youngsters were leaving the game if they didn't transition straight from NYC to the NRL.

Another concern about the current system is that the best young players aren't on show in the under-20s anyways, as those poised to get a call up to first grade were being blooded against seasoned players in the NSW Cup to prepare them for the rigours of the big time.

Even before the NYC was introduced, there were concerns that it wouldn't serve its purpose.

Back in 2007, Des Hasler predicted it would be a "glorified SG Ball competition", with fellow coaches Wayne Bennett, Neil Henry and Ivan Cleary outspoken about their preference for blooding their gun juniors in the open-age competitions.

Holden's sponsorship, along with broadcast commitments, mean there can be no changes for another two-and-a-half years. However, the ARLC believe the changes will further boost the profile of the state-based competitions while still giving broadcasters an attractive television product.

NYC initiatives, such as the 'no work, no study, no play' edict, are likely to remain to ensure juniors have post-football careers to fall back on.

One of the challenges for the League is than not every NRL club has its own NSW or Queensland Cup affiliate. Melbourne and Cronulla, for instance, both provide players for the Sharks' feeder club side.

However, that situation could soon change as Cronulla are in negotiations to partner with Newtown from next season.

The Jets' nine-year association with the Roosters will soon come to an end after the premiers opted to link with Wyong to give them a crack at the talent on the Central Coast.

Cronulla CEO Steve Noyce has a good relationship with Jets officials from his time at the Roosters and there is a possibility a Sharks-Jets association could be formalised by the end of the week.

https://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league...wing-board-20140809-1028og.html#ixzz3A5909nDN
 
snake77

snake77

Back in 2007, Des Hasler predicted it would be a "glorified SG Ball competition", with fellow coaches Wayne Bennett, Neil Henry and Ivan Cleary outspoken about their preference for blooding their gun juniors in the open-age competitions
Ivan Cleary obviously changed his thoughts from 2007 as we used to have all our best youngsters playing 20's and are now putting the better ones in the NSW Cup.

I might have jumped the gun a bit there; when did the Vulcan's first enter the NSW Cup? This may give some context on our previous strategy and the contracting at the time when the Vulcan's weren't in-house with the Warriors.
 
mrblonde

mrblonde

Nobody cares one bit about reserve grade - only coaches & die hard fan.
Sponsors dont care about, Journalists dont care about it, neither do the fans.

How many people would care about the U20s if they weren't on TV - and how many people only care about the U20s because they are now? You can't tell me the gamecrowds care about the U20s (or to be fair, the NSW Cup/Intrust) because when they're on TV, all you see are in the grounds are small pockets of 2 or 3 scattered around the seats - I mean seriously if they counted the number of people at Mt Smart Stadium at kick-off for the U20s/NSW, would it get past 50?

Ivan Cleary obviously changed his thoughts from 2007 as we used to have all our best youngsters playing 20's and are now putting the better ones in the NSW Cup.

I might have jumped the gun a bit there; when did the Vulcan's first enter the NSW Cup? This may give some context on our previous strategy and the contracting at the time when the Vulcan's weren't in-house with the Warriors.

The Lions - as they were then - began in 2007. I wouldn't have a foggiest about the rules regarding paying for visiting teams airfares/accomadation/groupies - I always assumed, wrongly I guess, that whatever the competition, that was always funded by the competition's head organisation.

If it come to one or the other, I'd rather an age open Reserves competition over the U20s, run by the NRL. Okay, the Warriors would struggle at first with under 20s players going into games against NRL players/bit players but for me the flip-side is that from Day 1 rather than Day 365/730 they'd be playing and training with those older/more experienced players (and obviously playing against as well) and that should get rid of their bad habits quicker, make them learn not to just rely on bulk/physique. Therefore shortening if not completely circumventing the "bouncing around" between the U20s and NSW that happens now.

Don't know how/if the Fox would fit into this, of course (does it fit into any step of the Warriors development plans now? I mean, do the Warriors have any sway such as telling the Marlins they're taking Sam Lousi this week, tough titty for the guy he's replacing?)
 

slaughterhouse.sa

How many people would care about the U20s if they weren't on TV - and how many people only care about the U20s because they are now? You can't tell me the gamecrowds care about the U20s (or to be fair, the NSW Cup/Intrust) because when they're on TV, all you see are in the grounds are small pockets of 2 or 3 scattered around the seats - I mean seriously if they counted the number of people at Mt Smart Stadium at kick-off for the U20s/NSW, would it get past 50?



The Lions - as they were then - began in 2007. I wouldn't have a foggiest about the rules regarding paying for visiting teams airfares/accomadation/groupies - I always assumed, wrongly I guess, that whatever the competition, that was always funded by the competition's head organisation.

If it come to one or the other, I'd rather an age open Reserves competition over the U20s, run by the NRL. Okay, the Warriors would struggle at first with under 20s players going into games against NRL players/bit players but for me the flip-side is that from Day 1 rather than Day 365/730 they'd be playing and training with those older/more experienced players (and obviously playing against as well) and that should get rid of their bad habits quicker, make them learn not to just rely on bulk/physique. Therefore shortening if not completely circumventing the "bouncing around" between the U20s and NSW that happens now.

ow many people care about the 20s???
Much more than NSW cup or Q Cup.

TV ratings are actually quite good.
I have heard that they rate higher than NPC and some Super 15 games.

Yeah how would the Warriors develop a player like ....Higano. He is 17 so he cant even play Fox yet.
Not being able to play 20s ...would stifle his development big time.

He would have to play under 17/under 18s or First XV until next year.
Then jump up to senior football and get bashed.

Then would have to jump up to NSW cup level.

What will happen like Tui....he will be played in NYC....then if he excels he will get to train with NRL/NSW cup.
Then by the time he is 21 he can be a NRL player.

When ready they have the option of progressing them.

As for boucning around....it actually a good method of development.
After all they are "bouncing" around at the same club, same moves, same wider group of people.
Not like Melbourne and fling up to Q cup etc.

What happens and those players cant actually make the NSW Cup team.
Where do they play then...Do you give up on them and send to the lowly fox.

Losing the 20s in any shape ...is not good. Especially not good for Warriors.

They would be loosing their player base,
Go from having nearly 51 players playing every week to having only 34.
 
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